Psychologist Richard Reid, PhD presents a lecture on how to perform comprehensive evaluations of students with complex communication and learning profiles.
Dr. Reid takes educators, SLPs, PTs, OTs, and psychologists beyond the necessary question of special education eligibility to consider topics such as:
- how to develop effective evaluation questions
- the contracted evaluator’s role and responsibilities
- basic properties and characteristics of tests
- kinds and meaning of test scores
- review of the different types of assessment tools
- areas that tests measure
- effective ways to share assessment results with others
This is Part 1 of a two-part lecture. Part 2 is available here.
Questions to consider:
1. What aspects or characteristics of a test would you review to determine the quality of the assessment instrument?
2. How might the standard error of measurement (SEM) be used to support a student with borderline eligibility for adult services?
Transcript
A full transcript of the session appears below.
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Here’s the things that we wanna make sure
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that we take care of while we’re together.
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Why do we assess students?
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And, this is something that
takes up a lot of our time.
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There’s a lot of paperwork involved.
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And, why the heck do we even
engage in this activity?
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So, I think it’s really
important to delineate
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those reasons, because I
believe some of those reasons
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are more important than others.
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And so, we get a hierarchy
of initiatives in place.
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What we’re gonna do, is
review some selected rules
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and regulations.
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This may feel a little dry,
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but there is important
things in this Vermont regs,
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which mirror the federal regs that have,
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to do with evaluations and
comprehensive reevaluations,
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that indicate what we must do.
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And, it suggests that everyone’s entitled
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to a certain level of evaluation.
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But, at the same time, there
are sections that tell us
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that we can be fairly
creative in how we do this.
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And, that’s what opens the door
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to what we’re gonna be talking
about during this session.
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How do we evaluate kids
who, or students who,
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look like they might be
really tough to evaluate?
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We’re just gonna chat about
who we’re talking about.
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And, just to, kind of, as a spoiler, this,
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when we started talking
about today’s series,
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workshop series,
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we’re thinking mostly about
low instance populations,
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students that attend our schools.
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But, as the more I thought about it,
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the stuff we’re gonna talk
about today, the stuff,
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the concepts, given that we’re going to,
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given the changes that
are coming down the road
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in special education eligibility,
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a lot of what we’re gonna talk about,
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applies to the most commonly
referred evaluation case.
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And, that’s learning
disabilities, and then,
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within learning disabilities, reading.
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So, we’re gonna make that
connection along the way, too,
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for you folks who have on your caseload,
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a broad range of students,
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you’re gonna find that many
of the things we talk about
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are gonna be applicable,
as your district moves away
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from a certain model of
identifying kids or students
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who are eligible to a more,
we’ll say, progressive model.
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We’re gonna talk about
what is it we’re assessing?
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The federal regs layout, a
whole, a while, a range of things
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hat says we need to consider,
doesn’t necessarily mean
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we need to assess each of each one,
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but we’re gonna look at what
are the things that we need
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to consider?
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And then, if we have
concerns in those areas,
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that’s what directs our
assessment activities.
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We’re gonna look at some
broad assessment tools.
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What are kind of the
tools that are out there?
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We’re gonna look at achievement
tests, cognitive tests,
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adaptive behavior, just
in the broad sense,
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what are they and what do they measure?
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And then, we’re gonna get
into the evaluation plan
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teaming meeting.
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One of the things that, as a psychologist,
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this is one of the important,
or contracted person,
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or anyone conducting the evaluation,
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this is the most important
meeting because it lets us know
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what are the questions
that are being answered.
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And then, I or whoever
is doing the evaluation,
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has a responsibility to
answer those questions.
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So, the answers you get are
only gonna be as good as
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the questions you ask.
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And, so, we’re gonna take a peek at,
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how do we provide guidance
to our evaluators,
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or people who are conducting evaluations,
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so that we get the results
that they’re looking for.
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(laughs) Now, don’t panic on this,
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but we’re gonna look at some basic
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psychometric concepts, there.
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I’m gonna do it in a way
that’s kind and supportive,
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but there are certain
things that we need to know
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as members of educational planning teams,
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and so that we can make
decisions about our students,
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and the veracity of the
data that we’re getting.
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And so, we’re just gonna
review some of those.
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There won’t be any quizzes or anything,
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but just, kind of, bring things to your.
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Along the way, we’re gonna
talk about common pitfalls
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of situations.
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I’ve put a number in
there that I have observed
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in working with teams
over the years, and also,
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which that came up when
working with the IT folks,
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during the planning for this.
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So, here, we’ll, kind of, put
those out that are commonly,
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you might, might be commonly
occurring for your teams.
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We’re gonna look at
scores, and what they mean.
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This is really important,
because there’s much more
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to these numbers, than meets the eyes.
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And so, again, I’m gonna try to be kind
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as I review these scores because
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some of them are not appropriate for use
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with the population that
we’re talking about here,
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a low instance populations.
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And, I’ll explain and give you
some visual representations
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of why that’s true,
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because that will allow
you to then guide your,
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(clears throat) the people
doing the evaluation to say,
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“no, we’re not really
interested in that score.
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and that score.
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Here’s what we’re looking for.”
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Okay?
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Again, we’re gonna review
the types of assessments
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that are out there.
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And then, the big part
we’re gonna look at,
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is the cross-battery assessment process.
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And, that might be a new term,
or it might be an old term
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for folks if you’ve heard it,
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but it’s (clears throat)
a process I’ve been using
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for my entire career
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because we’re gonna find that the business
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of publishing tests is no
different from any other business.
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So, at the risk of sharing too
much, I have very large feet.
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And, when I go in to buy a pair of shoes,
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I look at these nice shoes
on the shelf and I say,
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“could I? Can I get a pair of those?”
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And, they measure my foot and say,
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“well, they don’t come
in that size, you can’t.”
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So, I end up, either end up
with these plain loafers,
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because they just don’t make
’em for people with big feet
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like mine, or worse, the
salesperson comes out with a pair
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of size twelves and says,
“why don’t you try these?”
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Why the heck would I try
a pair of your shoes on
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that I know I’m not gonna fit?
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Well, the same is true with the testing,
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is that the test publishers
do not create, (clears throat)
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or publish a lot of tests, or
for low incidence populations
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because the market is not there.
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It’s just business.
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And, but we don’t wanna make
the salesman’s approach.
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We don’t want to use these
tests in the inappropriate way,
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and apply it.
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And, I’ve seen it when
I do record reviews,
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where some evaluators will use
a test that’s inappropriate
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for the individual, and
then report the results.
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And, those results are
perceived, or believed,
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to be accurate representations,
when they’re not.
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So, what we’re gonna do is
look at a variety of tests.
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And, I picked the most common ones,
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but I’m gonna encourage
you folks in the notes,
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or minutes, if you have certain tests
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that you’re wondering about,
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and you’re not clear of what they test,
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and how they test them,
put them in the chat box.
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And, what I’ll be doing for,
during our second session is,
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we’ll be looking at these tests
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and analyzing what are the requirements?
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Is this someone who with who
is deaf or hard of hearing?
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Could they participate
in this, and if not,
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is there a way to accommodate
it, so that they would?
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Then, we’ll talk about how
do we accommodate these tests
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without changing what they’re measuring?
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And then, we’ll look
at a variety of tests,
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and see what, and see if we
can develop some profiles
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from these tests, of pieces
of them that we can use.
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So, that’s what the Cross
Battery approach is,
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is finding out, are there
elements of variety of tests
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that are appropriate for
the student in question?
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I can answer the questions
that are developed
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by the educational planning team.
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We’re gonna be talking
about reporting out.
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Boy, think about, this is
really where we need to
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have our perspective taken.
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I’ve been in meetings where
there’s, (clears throat)
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social services are in the meeting.
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You got the building principal,
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you got the special ed director,
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you got the special education,
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you’ve got a host of professionals,
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and you got moms sitting
at the end of the table.
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This is a very intimidating and scary,
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can be a very intimidating,
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unless we turn it into a welcoming.
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And, so I wanna talk about,
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how do we report out information
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in a way that is comfortable,
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and so parents can understand it,
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and other lay-folks who might be there?
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And again, the lastly, the
last couple of things is,
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as I said, specific test analysis.
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We’re gonna look at tests and say,
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“okay, what’s the test? What
does it, and is it something
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that we can use with certain populations?”
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The number one that always comes up is,
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you’re required to determine initial
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or continued eligibility for services.
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And so, yeah, when, we
all know that if someone,
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anyone has a concern about a person,
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suspects a person might be
affected by a disability,
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they can request an
evaluation, and within 60 days,
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in most cases, we’re required to do that.
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So, this is, in fact,
someone who has a disability.
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And, then secondly, okay, now
that you have a disability,
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we are entitled to services,
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but we gotta check every three years.
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So, there we go.
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Continue to be in
compliance, that’s right.
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We gotta do the right
thing, or we get in trouble
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if we don’t follow the rules.
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And so, we’re gonna look
at a little of those rules
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to identify potential
strengths and challenges.
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So I, some of these are things we must do.
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Some of the ones, that I
think are higher order,
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more desirable things,
and this is one of them.
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Yes, if we can identify
youngster strengths,
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we can use some of those strengths
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to immediately rate, or deal
with the challenges, sure.
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And these, you folks came
up with all of these.
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To inform instruction and
program development. Exactly.
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It’s, okay, what do we need to do?
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One of the ones that I don’t
have here, that you folks have,
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which is an excellent
one, that I’m gonna add,
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is to gain baseline data.
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You can’t know how far you’ve come,
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if you don’t know where you started.
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So, that’s an excellent one, that.
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Okay, here’s the youngsters
status on this particular skill.
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Three years later, what’s that status?
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And so, the other piece is
to inform IEP development,
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exactly.
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Once, which for,
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that’s one of the main
purposes of evaluation is,
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00:10:01,890 –> 00:10:04,320
all assessment data
should inform instruction.
232
00:10:04,320 –> 00:10:06,930
Which, in fact, if you’re
eligible for special ed,
233
00:10:06,930 –> 00:10:09,273
it’s then guided by the IEP.
234
00:10:10,805 –> 00:10:15,449
Gather information related to
enabling involvement in praxis
235
00:10:15,449 –> 00:10:17,430
within the general ed curriculum.
236
00:10:17,430 –> 00:10:19,350
That’s one of the things
that’s in the regulations.
237
00:10:19,350 –> 00:10:22,293
And, it’s something that we
sometimes overlook, but yeah,
238
00:10:24,030 –> 00:10:26,250
did we find stuff out
through this evaluation,
239
00:10:26,250 –> 00:10:28,650
or is there something
that we need to look at
240
00:10:28,650 –> 00:10:30,840
that will enable greater access
241
00:10:30,840 –> 00:10:32,290
to the general ed curriculum.
242
00:10:33,630 –> 00:10:36,390
To document growth, so, okay.
243
00:10:36,390 –> 00:10:37,860
This is similar to the baseline.
244
00:10:37,860 –> 00:10:41,760
That’s if we’ve had baseline
data three years later,
245
00:10:41,760 –> 00:10:43,290
what’s that growth looking?
246
00:10:43,290 –> 00:10:45,690
And then lastly, accountability.
247
00:10:45,690 –> 00:10:49,229
If three years have gone
by, and we haven’t seen any
248
00:10:49,229 –> 00:10:53,040
substantial, notable
growth in an individual,
249
00:10:53,040 –> 00:10:54,585
we gotta start thinking,
250
00:10:54,585 –> 00:10:55,950
“what’s going on here? We
gotta get something going.”
251
00:10:55,950 –> 00:10:57,600
I’m sure that’s rarely the case,
252
00:10:57,600 –> 00:11:01,050
but that’s one of the issues that arises.
253
00:11:01,050 –> 00:11:04,200
So, we already have a big, big check mark
254
00:11:04,200 –> 00:11:08,297
for how well you folks
recognize why we do this.
255
00:11:11,280 –> 00:11:13,440
And, I’m encouraged by the fact
256
00:11:13,440 –> 00:11:15,912
that the overwhelming majority with you
257
00:11:15,912 –> 00:11:17,160
that recognize we gotta do it.
258
00:11:17,160 –> 00:11:17,993
That’s regs.
259
00:11:17,993 –> 00:11:20,100
But, then there are these other pieces,
260
00:11:20,100 –> 00:11:24,450
that the reasons we do it is
to increase better outcomes
261
00:11:24,450 –> 00:11:25,283
for students.
262
00:11:25,283 –> 00:11:26,950
That’s what all the other ones, so.
263
00:11:29,790 –> 00:11:31,680
All right. one of the
things I wanna point out
264
00:11:31,680 –> 00:11:34,110
in the jumping right in into the regs,
265
00:11:34,110 –> 00:11:37,410
and this is one of the
things that came out
266
00:11:37,410 –> 00:11:40,920
through our discussion
with, with the I team folks,
267
00:11:40,920 –> 00:11:43,080
and also that I’ve observed quite a bit,
268
00:11:43,080 –> 00:11:44,460
and it’s this piece right here,
269
00:11:44,460 –> 00:11:47,430
that if, it talks about reevaluation,
270
00:11:47,430 –> 00:11:50,703
it says we need to do
it every three years,
271
00:11:52,050 –> 00:11:54,937
but then it has this clause down here,
272
00:11:54,937 –> 00:11:57,150
“it shall occur at least
once every three years
273
00:11:57,150 –> 00:11:59,520
unless the parent and the LEA agree
274
00:11:59,520 –> 00:12:02,830
that reevaluation is unnecessary.”
275
00:12:02,830 –> 00:12:07,440
And, my personal perspective
is, I can’t think of a time
276
00:12:07,440 –> 00:12:10,020
when it would not be necessary.
277
00:12:10,020 –> 00:12:12,240
Three years have gone by.
278
00:12:12,240 –> 00:12:15,480
How are we gonna do all those
other more reasonable things?
279
00:12:15,480 –> 00:12:18,480
Remember, we said, sure, we
gotta do this reevaluation
280
00:12:18,480 –> 00:12:20,940
because it’s the law.
281
00:12:20,940 –> 00:12:23,790
But, then we had all the
other things that, I believe,
282
00:12:23,790 –> 00:12:27,150
are more important than being
in compliance with the law,
283
00:12:27,150 –> 00:12:30,090
informing the IEP, documenting
growth and all that.
284
00:12:30,090 –> 00:12:34,230
And so, in the absence of a
comprehensive reevaluation,
285
00:12:34,230 –> 00:12:35,760
we don’t have that data.
286
00:12:35,760 –> 00:12:38,973
And so, I think that at every turn,
287
00:12:39,894 –> 00:12:40,747
I think the the impetus should be,
288
00:12:40,747 –> 00:12:42,780
“yes, we are gonna conduct
289
00:12:42,780 –> 00:12:45,660
as comprehensive of a
reevaluation as we can,
290
00:12:45,660 –> 00:12:47,580
given the circumstances.”
291
00:12:47,580 –> 00:12:49,569
Personally, that’s a personal bias.
292
00:12:49,569 –> 00:12:51,964
I believe that all students,
293
00:12:51,964 –> 00:12:55,740
regardless of their impairments,
294
00:12:55,740 –> 00:12:59,553
are entitled to that close
look, every three years.
295
00:13:01,560 –> 00:13:04,473
One of the things that
frequently keep comes up is,
296
00:13:06,101 –> 00:13:09,480
is that people suggest that
certain things don’t change,
297
00:13:09,480 –> 00:13:12,360
they become stable over
time, and all that.
298
00:13:12,360 –> 00:13:16,230
And, then I would suggest
everything changes,
299
00:13:16,230 –> 00:13:17,160
over three years.
300
00:13:17,160 –> 00:13:19,113
So, for example, even if we,
301
00:13:20,141 –> 00:13:21,720
our brains are changing
every minute, that was,
302
00:13:21,720 –> 00:13:23,070
right now your brain is changing,
303
00:13:23,070 –> 00:13:25,320
you’re developing new synapses
because you’re listening
304
00:13:25,320 –> 00:13:27,540
to this, and you’re pruning
old ones you haven’t used.
305
00:13:27,540 –> 00:13:29,880
The same thing’s going on with
every one of our students.
306
00:13:29,880 –> 00:13:33,120
There’s, where our students are
being exposed to instruction
307
00:13:33,120 –> 00:13:33,953
over three years.
308
00:13:33,953 –> 00:13:36,240
There are changes occurring
within their basic skills,
309
00:13:36,240 –> 00:13:39,014
or within any skill that
you’re teaching them.
310
00:13:39,014 –> 00:13:43,560
And, we need to attend to all
those other positive reasons
311
00:13:43,560 –> 00:13:46,410
for doing reevaluations to get that data.
312
00:13:46,410 –> 00:13:48,505
Okay. So, again, that’s a personal bias,
313
00:13:48,505 –> 00:13:51,137
but the regulations clearly tell us,
314
00:13:51,137 –> 00:13:55,489
if we don’t have to do
it, I would suggest that,
315
00:13:55,489 –> 00:13:57,273
I believe it’s essential that we do.
316
00:13:57,273 –> 00:14:01,140
And, in spite of the fact
that we’re allowed not to.
317
00:14:01,140 –> 00:14:01,973
Okay.
318
00:14:03,450 –> 00:14:06,750
It’s, I think we mentioned
that Mary Ellen’s watching
319
00:14:06,750 –> 00:14:09,751
the chat, so if, I don’t
have the chat box up going,
320
00:14:09,751 –> 00:14:13,440
but I think she’s gonna let
me know if someone’s wants to,
321
00:14:13,440 –> 00:14:15,600
has a question that really
is important to answer,
322
00:14:15,600 –> 00:14:19,260
or has a, feel free to
disagree and throw something,
323
00:14:19,260 –> 00:14:21,570
and put something in there, as well.
324
00:14:21,570 –> 00:14:23,700
I’d like to try to make it
as interactive as possible,
325
00:14:23,700 –> 00:14:25,440
but, it’s a little tough.
326
00:14:25,440 –> 00:14:28,260
Okay, so let’s just talk
about who conducts it,
327
00:14:28,260 –> 00:14:30,240
and just to, just, again,
this is a refresher
328
00:14:30,240 –> 00:14:32,010
for many of you, but just wanted,
329
00:14:32,010 –> 00:14:33,870
let’s not forget all the important people
330
00:14:33,870 –> 00:14:35,095
we need to involve.
331
00:14:35,095 –> 00:14:36,900
You gotta have the LEA rep.
332
00:14:36,900 –> 00:14:38,430
LEA is their local agency.
333
00:14:38,430 –> 00:14:41,864
And, the reason is ’cause
you can’t do anything with,
334
00:14:41,864 –> 00:14:43,890
unless you, you might have
to spend a little money
335
00:14:43,890 –> 00:14:46,560
as a result of some of these things.
336
00:14:46,560 –> 00:14:51,560
And, many districts do not expend money,
337
00:14:51,720 –> 00:14:54,150
unless it’s approved by
an LEA representative.
338
00:14:54,150 –> 00:14:56,020
So you have someone there.
339
00:14:56,020 –> 00:14:57,778
But, the team might decide,
340
00:14:57,778 –> 00:15:02,186
“well, we wanna hire Elwood
Pratt to do the evaluation.
341
00:15:02,186 –> 00:15:04,016
And, we know he charged a
little more than other people,
342
00:15:04,016 –> 00:15:05,700
but he really knows a lot
about persons who were affected
343
00:15:05,700 –> 00:15:08,070
by autism and dialed right in.
344
00:15:08,070 –> 00:15:11,040
And, that has to get the wink
and the nod from someone.
345
00:15:11,040 –> 00:15:14,460
So, gotta have a general
ed teacher, for sure.
346
00:15:14,460 –> 00:15:16,200
That’s the whole purpose of special ed,
347
00:15:16,200 –> 00:15:19,080
is to allow access, kids
access to general ed.
348
00:15:19,080 –> 00:15:20,970
So, we have to know, what
are we allow ’em to access?
349
00:15:20,970 –> 00:15:22,530
We need to have their input.
350
00:15:22,530 –> 00:15:24,075
And, what are some of the,
351
00:15:24,075 –> 00:15:26,580
what are the things that
the general education folks
352
00:15:26,580 –> 00:15:28,680
want to know about this youngster,
353
00:15:28,680 –> 00:15:32,070
that will enable them to
provide support, and services,
354
00:15:32,070 –> 00:15:33,999
and instruction within the classroom?
355
00:15:33,999 –> 00:15:38,463
Anyone else who the parents
feel would be helpful.
356
00:15:39,450 –> 00:15:41,493
It could be a friend or neighbor,
357
00:15:42,572 –> 00:15:45,030
a youngster who might be
in therapy, their psych,
358
00:15:45,030 –> 00:15:48,362
their therapist, grandparent, whatever,
359
00:15:48,362 –> 00:15:51,870
whatever anything, anyone
who the parents feel
360
00:15:51,870 –> 00:15:53,943
might be of support.
361
00:15:55,650 –> 00:15:57,180
People who, whoops, sorry,
362
00:15:57,180 –> 00:15:59,730
people who can interpret the
instructional implications
363
00:15:59,730 –> 00:16:01,140
of the evaluation.
364
00:16:01,140 –> 00:16:03,930
And, that will include you
folks, most of you folks
365
00:16:03,930 –> 00:16:07,760
who are on this call, as
well as the evaluator.
366
00:16:07,760 –> 00:16:12,180
I know sometimes, I think
with virtual meetings now,
367
00:16:12,180 –> 00:16:15,090
it’s a little easier to have
the evaluator, actually,
368
00:16:15,090 –> 00:16:17,550
at the meeting, explaining the results.
369
00:16:17,550 –> 00:16:22,550
And, then we want that evaluator,
or who, to to be explicit
370
00:16:22,778 –> 00:16:26,850
and how, what are the implications
for this for instruction?
371
00:16:26,850 –> 00:16:29,610
And, other life events,
372
00:16:29,610 –> 00:16:32,410
depending on the student that
we’re talking about. Okay.
373
00:16:33,679 –> 00:16:37,337
There might be an educational
surrogate that’s there
374
00:16:37,337 –> 00:16:40,890
if the student, if the youngster’s
in the state’s custody,
375
00:16:40,890 –> 00:16:43,023
sometimes they appoint the surrogate.
376
00:16:45,300 –> 00:16:48,510
And, lastly, if appropriate,
the student and the child,
377
00:16:48,510 –> 00:16:50,110
my experience with them has been
378
00:16:51,073 –> 00:16:53,161
that most don’t want to
attend when you provide them.
379
00:16:53,161 –> 00:16:54,385
“Do you wanna come to this meeting?”
380
00:16:54,385 –> 00:16:57,510
If I know the youngster, I
try to encourage them to come.
381
00:16:57,510 –> 00:16:59,533
But, once in a while they come, but we,
382
00:16:59,533 –> 00:17:01,350
I think depending on
the age of the student,
383
00:17:01,350 –> 00:17:04,650
that we should offer
them that opportunity.
384
00:17:04,650 –> 00:17:07,620
Okay, so that’s who’s
gonna be at that meeting,
385
00:17:07,620 –> 00:17:10,440
minimally, who’s gonna
be at the meeting, okay?
386
00:17:10,440 –> 00:17:11,760
All right.
387
00:17:11,760 –> 00:17:14,670
So, just to, kind of, lay
out who we’re talking about
388
00:17:14,670 –> 00:17:19,670
during this series, is what
I’ve come to be known as,
389
00:17:19,867 –> 00:17:21,930
“Students with Complex Profiles.”
390
00:17:21,930 –> 00:17:24,487
And, in my training, we used to call,
391
00:17:24,487 –> 00:17:26,460
“Persons with Low Incidence Population.
392
00:17:26,460 –> 00:17:31,460
These are not, these are kids
who we don’t, that are not
393
00:17:32,700 –> 00:17:35,160
frequently occurring within
the population, and that,
394
00:17:35,160 –> 00:17:38,850
so bring unique challenges
to us as evaluators,
395
00:17:38,850 –> 00:17:41,277
and as service providers, and as teachers,
396
00:17:41,277 –> 00:17:45,990
and so persons affected by
Autism Spectrum Disorder,
397
00:17:45,990 –> 00:17:49,293
multiple dis, intellectual
disabilities, TBI.
398
00:17:51,090 –> 00:17:55,380
Now, (clears throat) as I
mentioned in the introduction,
399
00:17:55,380 –> 00:17:57,453
as I thought about our work together,
400
00:17:58,890 –> 00:18:01,920
if you’re working in the
special education right now,
401
00:18:01,920 –> 00:18:05,280
you’re aware that, that
model where the psychologist
402
00:18:05,280 –> 00:18:08,493
used to come in, and do
a cognitive assessment,
403
00:18:08,493 –> 00:18:10,800
then perhaps also do some achievement,
404
00:18:10,800 –> 00:18:13,200
or you might do the achievement testing,
405
00:18:13,200 –> 00:18:14,763
and we compare the scores,
406
00:18:15,690 –> 00:18:20,640
and then if there’s a
significant discrepancy between,
407
00:18:20,640 –> 00:18:23,370
or difference between
their cognitive score
408
00:18:23,370 –> 00:18:24,840
and their achievement score,
409
00:18:24,840 –> 00:18:28,140
that’s suggestive of
specific learning disability.
410
00:18:28,140 –> 00:18:30,150
And, that’s known as
the discrepancy model.
411
00:18:30,150 –> 00:18:32,670
Well, (clears throat)
all of you were aware
412
00:18:32,670 –> 00:18:34,620
if you were working in the
public schools these days,
413
00:18:34,620 –> 00:18:37,464
that model is going
away, and, which is good.
414
00:18:37,464 –> 00:18:41,580
For years, I’ve been
doing the wrong thing,
415
00:18:41,580 –> 00:18:43,170
the best way that I could.
416
00:18:43,170 –> 00:18:46,200
But, that there, and
then I’ll explain that
417
00:18:46,200 –> 00:18:47,370
as the it progresses,
418
00:18:47,370 –> 00:18:49,290
it’s some of the tools we choose,
419
00:18:49,290 –> 00:18:51,313
allow us to use the discrepancy model
420
00:18:51,313 –> 00:18:52,920
in the most accurate way.
421
00:18:52,920 –> 00:18:54,208
But, it’s not the best way to identify
422
00:18:54,208 –> 00:18:57,180
a specific learning disability.
423
00:18:57,180 –> 00:19:00,500
And, depending on where
your district’s heading,
424
00:19:00,500 –> 00:19:05,040
they’re gonna be asked to
identify what are known as
425
00:19:05,040 –> 00:19:06,810
an evidence-based process,
426
00:19:06,810 –> 00:19:09,870
for identifying learning disabilities.
427
00:19:09,870 –> 00:19:13,530
And, two of the most common
ones are what’s known as
428
00:19:13,530 –> 00:19:15,540
the Response to Intervention model,
429
00:19:15,540 –> 00:19:18,690
and our Patterns of
Strengths and Weakness model.
430
00:19:18,690 –> 00:19:21,750
Well, both of those models are dependent
431
00:19:21,750 –> 00:19:24,109
on the Cross-Battery Assessment model.
432
00:19:24,109 –> 00:19:28,147
It’s no longer, we’re looking to see,
433
00:19:28,147 –> 00:19:30,420
“is the youngster disabled,
434
00:19:30,420 –> 00:19:32,520
or does the youngster have a disability?”
435
00:19:32,520 –> 00:19:35,413
Now, we’re looking as, “why
isn’t the youngster performing
436
00:19:35,413 –> 00:19:37,800
to the level that we would hope,
437
00:19:37,800 –> 00:19:40,650
given the services we’re providing?
438
00:19:40,650 –> 00:19:42,570
And, that’s gonna require evaluators
439
00:19:42,570 –> 00:19:47,310
to have an in-depth understanding
of the variety of tools
440
00:19:47,310 –> 00:19:48,143
out there.
441
00:19:48,143 –> 00:19:52,290
So, for example, in a RTI model,
442
00:19:52,290 –> 00:19:55,320
or Patterns of Strength
and Weakness model,
443
00:19:55,320 –> 00:19:58,438
when it eventually gets to
the point where an evaluation
444
00:19:58,438 –> 00:20:02,790
is thought to be the best plan of action
445
00:20:02,790 –> 00:20:04,374
to help figure out what’s happening,
446
00:20:04,374 –> 00:20:06,900
they’re not asking “is
the student eligible?”
447
00:20:06,900 –> 00:20:08,017
They’re asking questions like,
448
00:20:08,017 –> 00:20:10,890
“okay, I’ve been providing
reading instruction
449
00:20:10,890 –> 00:20:13,934
using this evidence-based
program for six months,
450
00:20:13,934 –> 00:20:18,720
and the data shows me that
he’s really not gaining
451
00:20:18,720 –> 00:20:19,865
in his skills.
452
00:20:19,865 –> 00:20:24,330
And, the other thing is I provide
instruction on, on Monday,
453
00:20:24,330 –> 00:20:26,160
and he comes in on Tuesday,
454
00:20:26,160 –> 00:20:29,370
and it’s like he’s never
seen the information before.”
455
00:20:29,370 –> 00:20:31,530
That’s a whole different
way of approaching a,
456
00:20:31,530 –> 00:20:33,390
that quest, that now those questions
457
00:20:33,390 –> 00:20:36,120
the team is gonna develop
is related to that.
458
00:20:36,120 –> 00:20:38,460
And so, the psychologist,
or whoever’s doing it,
459
00:20:38,460 –> 00:20:41,880
is gonna probably take a
look at attentional issues,
460
00:20:41,880 –> 00:20:45,390
long-term memory, (coughs)
long-term retrieval,
461
00:20:45,390 –> 00:20:46,350
short-term memory.
462
00:20:46,350 –> 00:20:48,510
What are the things that
might be contributing to this.
463
00:20:48,510 –> 00:20:50,250
It’s no longer the broad picture.
464
00:20:50,250 –> 00:20:54,150
It’s now, “how do we get
down to the nitty-gritty,
465
00:20:54,150 –> 00:20:56,763
and diagnose what the issues are?”
466
00:20:56,763 –> 00:20:58,020
And, in order to do that,
467
00:20:58,020 –> 00:21:02,160
you have to have this in-depth
understanding of the tools
468
00:21:02,160 –> 00:21:03,090
that are available to you.
469
00:21:03,090 –> 00:21:06,510
So this cross-battery assessment approach
470
00:21:06,510 –> 00:21:07,530
that we’re gonna talk about,
471
00:21:07,530 –> 00:21:09,420
that has been in place for students
472
00:21:09,420 –> 00:21:13,820
with low incidence disabilities,
473
00:21:13,820 –> 00:21:15,750
it’s been in place for quite a while.
474
00:21:15,750 –> 00:21:20,575
It’s now, gonna be, now, used
with our most common referral
475
00:21:20,575 –> 00:21:25,575
for an evaluation, is for a
suspected learning disability.
476
00:21:28,230 –> 00:21:31,260
And, within that, the most
common suspected disability
477
00:21:31,260 –> 00:21:32,760
is the area of reading.
478
00:21:32,760 –> 00:21:35,790
And so, those folks now
are gonna be exposed
479
00:21:35,790 –> 00:21:38,340
to this new model where we’re
gonna have to figure out
480
00:21:38,340 –> 00:21:41,910
why is it that, not that just
that you have that discrepancy
481
00:21:41,910 –> 00:21:43,890
that suggests there’s something going on,
482
00:21:43,890 –> 00:21:46,260
we now wanna know why is it going on.
483
00:21:46,260 –> 00:21:48,093
Okay? Right.
484
00:21:51,341 –> 00:21:53,372
The question about what do we assess.
485
00:21:53,372 –> 00:21:56,713
So, the regulations are quite clear
486
00:21:56,713 –> 00:21:58,770
about what we’re to consider.
487
00:21:58,770 –> 00:22:02,343
So, there’s a difference between
considering and assessing.
488
00:22:03,210 –> 00:22:05,700
And, so according to the regs,
489
00:22:05,700 –> 00:22:09,180
we’re supposed to consider
each of these areas
490
00:22:09,180 –> 00:22:12,567
whenever we’re conducting
a comprehensive evaluation,
491
00:22:12,567 –> 00:22:16,377
And, things like physical characteristics.
492
00:22:16,377 –> 00:22:21,377
And so, you may have a youngster
who has, who wears glasses.
493
00:22:23,790 –> 00:22:26,190
We know by checking with the nurse
494
00:22:26,190 –> 00:22:30,612
that his glasses prescription
is up to date. Okay.
495
00:22:30,612 –> 00:22:33,360
We don’t need to do anything
more. We’ve considered that.
496
00:22:33,360 –> 00:22:35,580
However, you might have a student
497
00:22:35,580 –> 00:22:38,493
with a degenerative hearing loss,
498
00:22:39,801 –> 00:22:41,797
and you now may want to know,
499
00:22:41,797 –> 00:22:43,718
“wait a minute, in order to get,
500
00:22:43,718 –> 00:22:45,210
we need to get an audiological done,
501
00:22:45,210 –> 00:22:49,170
because we wanna know to what
degree has his hearing changed
502
00:22:49,170 –> 00:22:51,450
over the past three years,
whatever it might be.
503
00:22:51,450 –> 00:22:53,760
So, depending on who it is,
504
00:22:53,760 –> 00:22:57,542
you may have to address
something in each of these areas.
505
00:22:57,542 –> 00:23:02,542
Now, the areas that adaptive
behavior. (clears throat)
506
00:23:02,677 –> 00:23:06,300
“Is he, can the youngster, well,
the individual in question,
507
00:23:06,300 –> 00:23:08,700
respond to the day-to-day demands,
508
00:23:08,700 –> 00:23:12,060
placed on him by our culture,
509
00:23:12,060 –> 00:23:14,460
that are appropriate for their age?”
510
00:23:14,460 –> 00:23:17,340
And, I would suggest
that not only includes
511
00:23:17,340 –> 00:23:20,640
the life space demands outside of school,
512
00:23:20,640 –> 00:23:23,940
but also in school, (clears
throat) in terms of mobility,
513
00:23:23,940 –> 00:23:25,230
ability to get around school,
514
00:23:25,230 –> 00:23:27,060
ability to participate
in a general setting.
515
00:23:27,060 –> 00:23:29,410
Whatever they, what are the things
516
00:23:30,847 –> 00:23:32,447
that are facilitating that participation?
517
00:23:32,447 –> 00:23:33,390
What are the things that
are getting in the way?
518
00:23:33,390 –> 00:23:35,520
So, we need to look at that,
519
00:23:35,520 –> 00:23:37,350
and we’ll talk about
some instruments later on
520
00:23:37,350 –> 00:23:38,954
that measure those.
521
00:23:38,954 –> 00:23:41,700
It asks us to consider,
522
00:23:41,700 –> 00:23:43,860
might there be a need
for assisted technology?
523
00:23:43,860 –> 00:23:46,500
And, I know that’s a big
one in the population
524
00:23:46,500 –> 00:23:48,176
that we’re talking about.
525
00:23:48,176 –> 00:23:53,130
And, if so, do we need to conduct
an evaluation to determine
526
00:23:53,130 –> 00:23:57,450
what might be the most
appropriate technology to use?
527
00:23:57,450 –> 00:23:59,730
And then, we’d have a tryout, and again,
528
00:23:59,730 –> 00:24:01,260
more data to find out,
529
00:24:01,260 –> 00:24:03,513
are we going down the right track?
530
00:24:04,943 –> 00:24:07,863
They want us to, or the feds want us to,
531
00:24:08,744 –> 00:24:09,577
and the state wants us to,
532
00:24:10,428 –> 00:24:11,700
take social, emotional,
behavioral characteristics.
533
00:24:11,700 –> 00:24:13,980
It’s so important to remember and recall
534
00:24:13,980 –> 00:24:16,320
that our students don’t
leave their suitcases
535
00:24:16,320 –> 00:24:19,950
full of baggage at the door
when they come into school.
536
00:24:19,950 –> 00:24:22,320
If you have students who, things ain’t,
537
00:24:22,320 –> 00:24:24,180
haven’t been going well with mom and dad.
538
00:24:24,180 –> 00:24:27,570
and dad’s living somewhere else,
539
00:24:27,570 –> 00:24:29,820
and I mean, that’s, kind
of, all these things,
540
00:24:29,820 –> 00:24:31,740
life events that happen outside of school
541
00:24:31,740 –> 00:24:34,083
impact kids’ performance.
542
00:24:36,360 –> 00:24:37,350
This whole notion,
543
00:24:37,350 –> 00:24:41,160
some students start to feel a
little yucky about themselves
544
00:24:41,160 –> 00:24:45,780
when they realize that they
see other students progressing
545
00:24:45,780 –> 00:24:48,090
at a rate greater than themselves,
546
00:24:48,090 –> 00:24:49,740
and that has an impact on them.
547
00:24:49,740 –> 00:24:52,380
And, sometimes they engage
in self-defeating behavior
548
00:24:52,380 –> 00:24:54,150
that we need to address.
549
00:24:54,150 –> 00:24:57,002
Okay, speech characteristics.
550
00:24:57,002 –> 00:25:01,680
Boy, I tell anyone who’s
looking for a career,
551
00:25:01,680 –> 00:25:03,960
young person, go into speech language,
552
00:25:03,960 –> 00:25:05,700
we have such a shortage.
553
00:25:05,700 –> 00:25:09,000
And, there are speech language
pathologists that I know,
554
00:25:09,000 –> 00:25:12,360
are just overworked and over-extended.
555
00:25:12,360 –> 00:25:15,330
But, anyway, just kudos to those.
556
00:25:15,330 –> 00:25:16,533
But, anyway, are there,
557
00:25:17,541 –> 00:25:20,423
there are speech things
that we need to understand.
558
00:25:20,423 –> 00:25:21,892
With our kids, that’s frequently something
559
00:25:21,892 –> 00:25:22,800
that we have to look at.
560
00:25:22,800 –> 00:25:24,240
And then, moving from speech,
561
00:25:24,240 –> 00:25:26,730
to the whole notion, bit
different from people,
562
00:25:26,730 –> 00:25:28,503
language and communication skills.
563
00:25:29,652 –> 00:25:31,860
Is this someone who has a
augmentative communication system?
564
00:25:31,860 –> 00:25:33,750
Is this someone who might
consider for signing
565
00:25:33,750 –> 00:25:35,550
or whatever it might be?
566
00:25:35,550 –> 00:25:39,732
And then, vocational needs.
567
00:25:39,732 –> 00:25:43,530
This is true and this is,
you know, (clears throat)
568
00:25:43,530 –> 00:25:45,750
Vermont is just, this, kind of, an aside.
569
00:25:45,750 –> 00:25:47,940
I don’t know if people
remember Susan Hasazi,
570
00:25:47,940 –> 00:25:50,130
but it was her research,
571
00:25:50,130 –> 00:25:51,960
and her advocacy at the federal level
572
00:25:51,960 –> 00:25:55,800
who got this whole vocational
transition stuff going,
573
00:25:55,800 –> 00:25:57,960
and across the country,
and not just in Vermont.
574
00:25:57,960 –> 00:26:01,710
And, years and years ago she
did a survey of young people
575
00:26:01,710 –> 00:26:04,595
who had graduated from high school,
576
00:26:04,595 –> 00:26:07,710
and with significant challenges,
and what were they up to?
577
00:26:07,710 –> 00:26:11,460
And, she found that most of
them were not up to much.
578
00:26:11,460 –> 00:26:15,337
And so, that’s what spurred
the whole notion of,
579
00:26:15,337 –> 00:26:19,800
“if we now start transition
services to adult services
580
00:26:19,800 –> 00:26:22,620
early on in high school,
get everyone on the team,
581
00:26:22,620 –> 00:26:25,170
and we start going, and other
things that we can start,
582
00:26:25,170 –> 00:26:27,240
are there assessments we
need to do, or do we need
583
00:26:27,240 –> 00:26:30,000
to address certain skills
that a youngster needs,
584
00:26:30,000 –> 00:26:34,683
in order to be successful
in a vocational environment?
585
00:26:36,450 –> 00:26:38,824
And then, skills in the
learning environment. (giggles)
586
00:26:38,824 –> 00:26:41,618
what skills does this youngsta’
have, that it has to have,
587
00:26:41,618 –> 00:26:44,610
to participate in the
learning environment?
588
00:26:44,610 –> 00:26:48,180
Then that can be anything from
orienting in the direction
589
00:26:48,180 –> 00:26:51,630
of the speaker, to taking
notes, or whatever.
590
00:26:51,630 –> 00:26:53,760
Whatever it might be, sort
of, that they might be getting
591
00:26:53,760 –> 00:26:57,243
in the way of the
individual’s progress there.
592
00:26:58,080 –> 00:27:00,842
I forgot to mention that
we are gonna take a break
593
00:27:00,842 –> 00:27:03,780
at 10 minutes before the hour, each hour,
594
00:27:03,780 –> 00:27:06,630
so you can get outta your virtual seats.
595
00:27:06,630 –> 00:27:09,210
And so, I just wanna let you
know that’ll be happening.
596
00:27:09,210 –> 00:27:12,977
Okay, all right, and then,
look at all this stuff.
597
00:27:12,977 –> 00:27:16,230
We’re asked, “what are
relevant life circumstances?”
598
00:27:16,230 –> 00:27:18,453
I mentioned the one about the family.
599
00:27:19,830 –> 00:27:24,830
Community, how I’ve been in
situations where the youngsters
600
00:27:24,840 –> 00:27:29,550
living in this small community,
with lots of families nearby
601
00:27:29,550 –> 00:27:32,400
and there’s a feud between
a couple of the families,
602
00:27:32,400 –> 00:27:34,650
and this keeps carried on at the school.
603
00:27:34,650 –> 00:27:36,672
This can have an influence anyway.
604
00:27:36,672 –> 00:27:39,000
And, any kind of environmental factors
605
00:27:39,000 –> 00:27:42,347
that might be getting in the
way, accessibility issues,
606
00:27:42,347 –> 00:27:45,480
and things like that. Okay.
607
00:27:45,480 –> 00:27:49,860
And then, we’re gonna look at intellectual
608
00:27:49,860 –> 00:27:53,504
or cognitive characteristics,
and you folks mentioned this,
609
00:27:53,504 –> 00:27:56,737
and then the regs, we’re gonna
see in a minute, it says,
610
00:27:56,737 –> 00:27:59,640
“we’re not really interested
in that big old score
611
00:27:59,640 –> 00:28:03,060
that says, ‘okay, here’s your
IQ or your GIA,’ or whatever.
612
00:28:03,060 –> 00:28:05,910
But, but we are really interested in,
613
00:28:05,910 –> 00:28:08,160
and what are your strengths
with your learning abilities,
614
00:28:08,160 –> 00:28:11,157
and in particular your
reasoning abilities?”
615
00:28:12,330 –> 00:28:15,002
And, then lastly, of the
things that we have to,
616
00:28:15,002 –> 00:28:18,864
is that’s why we’re here,
basic skills. (coughs)
617
00:28:18,864 –> 00:28:22,170
Purpose of education is
to inculcate the skills
618
00:28:22,170 –> 00:28:23,670
that are listed here.
619
00:28:23,670 –> 00:28:26,826
And, we’re gonna want to
evaluate each of these
620
00:28:26,826 –> 00:28:31,470
to be sure that, as you said,
if it’s initial evaluation,
621
00:28:31,470 –> 00:28:35,640
to establish the baseline,
and so we’ll know what are,
622
00:28:35,640 –> 00:28:38,159
where the individual
strengths and challenges are,
623
00:28:38,159 –> 00:28:39,750
within these skill areas.
624
00:28:39,750 –> 00:28:43,143
And then, inform our instruction,
and our IEP development.
625
00:28:44,207 –> 00:28:45,984
Okay?
626
00:28:45,984 –> 00:28:49,653
Okay, what are we gonna use?
627
00:28:51,090 –> 00:28:54,120
Okay, so this is key, right here.
628
00:28:54,120 –> 00:28:55,950
I don’t know if it’s
showing up red or on yours,
629
00:28:55,950 –> 00:28:59,820
but, to ensure that, if an
assessment is administered
630
00:28:59,820 –> 00:29:02,240
to a child with impaired sensory, manual,
631
00:29:02,240 –> 00:29:05,100
or speaking skills, the assessment results
632
00:29:05,100 –> 00:29:07,148
accurately reflect the child’s aptitude,
633
00:29:07,148 –> 00:29:10,287
or achievement level, or
whatever other factors
634
00:29:10,287 –> 00:29:12,460
the test purports to measure,
635
00:29:12,460 –> 00:29:14,640
rather than reflecting the
child’s impaired sensory,
636
00:29:14,640 –> 00:29:15,780
manual, speaking skills.
637
00:29:15,780 –> 00:29:17,220
That’s a mouthful.
638
00:29:17,220 –> 00:29:19,440
But, I see it happen all the time,
639
00:29:19,440 –> 00:29:21,944
where I’ll conduct a record review,
640
00:29:21,944 –> 00:29:25,713
and an evaluator has administered a test,
641
00:29:26,580 –> 00:29:30,690
and I know that this youngster
could not participate fully
642
00:29:30,690 –> 00:29:33,570
in this test because of their disability.
643
00:29:33,570 –> 00:29:36,540
And, in the report it
says that that test score
644
00:29:36,540 –> 00:29:40,950
is an accurate reflection of
the skills, which is not true.
645
00:29:40,950 –> 00:29:42,780
And so, in this day and age.
646
00:29:42,780 –> 00:29:44,100
you would think that
wouldn’t be happening,
647
00:29:44,100 –> 00:29:46,410
but it continues, it continues to happen.
648
00:29:46,410 –> 00:29:48,150
So, what this is telling us,
649
00:29:48,150 –> 00:29:51,030
is when we talk about our
cross-battery assessment,
650
00:29:51,030 –> 00:29:54,210
we have to pick things, assessment tools,
651
00:29:54,210 –> 00:29:56,460
that the youngster can participate in,
652
00:29:56,460 –> 00:29:58,908
and they’re not tools that
are measuring the fact that
653
00:29:58,908 –> 00:30:01,760
they’re affected by cerebral
palsy and they can’t,
654
00:30:01,760 –> 00:30:03,870
their motor movements are choppy,
655
00:30:03,870 –> 00:30:06,210
and they can’t put a
set of blocks together
656
00:30:06,210 –> 00:30:10,011
within a timed set, a
certain specific time amount.
657
00:30:10,011 –> 00:30:12,260
So, their inability to do that is a result
658
00:30:12,260 –> 00:30:16,110
of their motor skills, not
because their visual-spatial
659
00:30:16,110 –> 00:30:19,953
skills tell them that they’re
not able to do that, okay?
660
00:30:19,953 –> 00:30:21,420
Okay.
661
00:30:21,420 –> 00:30:23,700
The second thing they warn us about,
662
00:30:23,700 –> 00:30:27,330
is the test that we use. (coughs)
663
00:30:27,330 –> 00:30:31,680
Those tailored to assess specific
areas of educational need,
664
00:30:31,680 –> 00:30:34,050
and not merely those designed to provide
665
00:30:34,050 –> 00:30:36,870
a single, general, intelligence quotient.
666
00:30:36,870 –> 00:30:39,960
So, we’re gonna get into this later,
667
00:30:39,960 –> 00:30:43,126
but there are some cognitive
tests out there that,
668
00:30:43,126 –> 00:30:45,859
well as you know, so what happens is,
669
00:30:45,859 –> 00:30:49,110
every cognitive test is
gonna give you a big score.
670
00:30:49,110 –> 00:30:52,152
And, in most cases, I
would say nearly all cases,
671
00:30:52,152 –> 00:30:55,080
that big score is reliable and valid.
672
00:30:55,080 –> 00:30:58,110
And, we’ll talk about what
that means in a little bit.
673
00:30:58,110 –> 00:31:02,490
However, many tests, that big score might
674
00:31:02,490 –> 00:31:06,770
be comprised of 10, what are
known as, subtest scores.
675
00:31:06,770 –> 00:31:11,770
And, those subtest scores
are not reliable enough
676
00:31:12,976 –> 00:31:17,220
to draw conclusions about what
each subtest is measuring,
677
00:31:17,220 –> 00:31:18,540
in many cases.
678
00:31:18,540 –> 00:31:21,360
So, there’s a statistical phenomenon,
679
00:31:21,360 –> 00:31:23,133
that the more data you have,
680
00:31:24,060 –> 00:31:26,850
the more reliable your score becomes.
681
00:31:26,850 –> 00:31:30,111
So, when you have an IQ
score that contributes,
682
00:31:30,111 –> 00:31:35,111
is made up of 10 subtests,
and we’ll say that, perhaps,
683
00:31:37,290 –> 00:31:39,990
eight of them don’t have
high enough reliability,
684
00:31:39,990 –> 00:31:42,210
but their combination of those,
685
00:31:42,210 –> 00:31:45,270
result in a reliable overall score.
686
00:31:45,270 –> 00:31:48,540
So, that may be helpful, in
terms of determining, say,
687
00:31:48,540 –> 00:31:51,060
eligibility for a particular program,
688
00:31:51,060 –> 00:31:54,358
if your, your intelligence
or your accountabilities
689
00:31:54,358 –> 00:31:55,350
has to follow at a certain level.
690
00:31:55,350 –> 00:31:58,620
But, it doesn’t help us in
figuring out what’s going on,
691
00:31:58,620 –> 00:31:59,790
the educational need.
692
00:31:59,790 –> 00:32:01,797
What are the strengths?
Wat are the challenges?
693
00:32:01,797 –> 00:32:04,380
And so I wanna, that’s
one of our first terms.
694
00:32:04,380 –> 00:32:05,880
There’s never, there’s
not gonna be a quiz.
695
00:32:05,880 –> 00:32:08,490
But, here’s one of my first
terms I want us to distinguish.
696
00:32:08,490 –> 00:32:10,500
The difference between
a test and a subtest,
697
00:32:10,500 –> 00:32:14,790
is that a test can stand alone by itself,
698
00:32:14,790 –> 00:32:17,940
because it has high enough
reliability and validity.
699
00:32:17,940 –> 00:32:22,680
A subtest has been found not
to have high enough reliability
700
00:32:22,680 –> 00:32:25,110
and validity. (coughs)
701
00:32:25,110 –> 00:32:28,230
And so, it needs to be
combined with other tests.
702
00:32:28,230 –> 00:32:31,050
And, sometimes that’ll
be called an index score.
703
00:32:31,050 –> 00:32:34,710
So, for example, you might
have two tests that visual,
704
00:32:34,710 –> 00:32:38,373
that measure visual processing on a test,
705
00:32:39,240 –> 00:32:43,050
neither of which have
strong enough reliability,
706
00:32:43,050 –> 00:32:45,120
but when you combine them, you get,
707
00:32:45,120 –> 00:32:49,140
what might be called the
visual processing index.
708
00:32:49,140 –> 00:32:51,750
So, it’s a composite score,
a combination of two,
709
00:32:51,750 –> 00:32:54,779
which now has a reliable score,
710
00:32:54,779 –> 00:32:57,285
because of the statistics involved.
711
00:32:57,285 –> 00:32:59,190
But, you have to be careful
712
00:32:59,190 –> 00:33:01,620
about drawing too many
conclusions about the performance
713
00:33:01,620 –> 00:33:04,890
on the individual tests
that comprise that,
714
00:33:04,890 –> 00:33:06,423
because of the reliability,
715
00:33:06,423 –> 00:33:09,943
and, we’ll talk about what we’re
looking for in reliability.
716
00:33:09,943 –> 00:33:10,893
Okay?
717
00:33:12,128 –> 00:33:14,680
And then, lastly, on this slide,
718
00:33:14,680 –> 00:33:16,260
ensure that assessment
tools and strategies provide
719
00:33:16,260 –> 00:33:17,790
relevant information,
720
00:33:17,790 –> 00:33:20,280
to directly assist the
IEP team in determining
721
00:33:20,280 –> 00:33:21,637
that educational needs.
722
00:33:21,637 –> 00:33:25,725
This goes, not only to the
strategies, but to the scores.
723
00:33:25,725 –> 00:33:27,840
So, here’s a rhetorical question,
724
00:33:27,840 –> 00:33:30,076
’cause I know you can’t all answer,
725
00:33:30,076 –> 00:33:34,380
but suppose I were to do an
adaptive behavior assessment
726
00:33:34,380 –> 00:33:37,800
of one of your students
who’s in the second grade,
727
00:33:37,800 –> 00:33:42,300
and he’s eight years old, and
then I tell you that he has
728
00:33:42,300 –> 00:33:45,990
an age equivalent score of a
three years old, five months.
729
00:33:45,990 –> 00:33:49,290
He’s performing at a three
years old, five months level.
730
00:33:49,290 –> 00:33:52,620
Does that help you determine strategies,
731
00:33:52,620 –> 00:33:55,326
and provide relevant, useful information,
732
00:33:55,326 –> 00:33:57,840
in terms of meeting
this youngster’s needs?
733
00:33:57,840 –> 00:33:59,187
I would suggest “no.”
734
00:34:00,030 –> 00:34:02,190
And so, we’re gonna look
at the kinds of scores
735
00:34:02,190 –> 00:34:03,510
that we’re gonna be looking for,
736
00:34:03,510 –> 00:34:05,520
and that we are entitled to ask for,
737
00:34:05,520 –> 00:34:08,610
from people who we contract with,
738
00:34:08,610 –> 00:34:11,010
but also, that we should be providing,
739
00:34:11,010 –> 00:34:13,740
or selecting for use, to give
more accurate information
740
00:34:13,740 –> 00:34:15,783
about what’s happening with a youngster.
741
00:34:17,100 –> 00:34:19,290
Okay? All right.
742
00:34:19,290 –> 00:34:21,593
So, how the heck are we
gonna do this whole thing?
743
00:34:21,593 –> 00:34:24,390
We’re gonna use a variety
of assessment tools
744
00:34:24,390 –> 00:34:25,940
and strategies.
745
00:34:25,940 –> 00:34:27,453
And, it tells us we can.
746
00:34:27,453 –> 00:34:29,737
Look at this, it says, “use,”
this is right from the regs,
747
00:34:29,737 –> 00:34:32,130
“use a variety of assessment
tools and strategies
748
00:34:32,130 –> 00:34:34,410
to gather relevant,
functional, developmental,
749
00:34:34,410 –> 00:34:36,450
and academic information,” dah, dah, dah.
750
00:34:36,450 –> 00:34:38,940
So, this is telling us that we can be
751
00:34:38,940 –> 00:34:41,373
as creative as possible,
752
00:34:43,260 –> 00:34:46,710
and as long as we follow some guidelines,
753
00:34:46,710 –> 00:34:48,090
which we’re gonna review.
754
00:34:48,090 –> 00:34:49,860
So, we can be creative as possible,
755
00:34:49,860 –> 00:34:54,180
in terms of gathering
assessment information,
756
00:34:54,180 –> 00:34:56,940
the practices we use, the
strategies we can use,
757
00:34:56,940 –> 00:34:59,400
as long as we do adhere
to some guidelines.
758
00:34:59,400 –> 00:35:01,108
And, we’ll talk about what those might be.
759
00:35:01,108 –> 00:35:02,860
Okay?
760
00:35:02,860 –> 00:35:05,340
Here’s my favorite schools.
761
00:35:05,340 –> 00:35:07,110
What’s an assessment tool? It’s anything.
762
00:35:07,110 –> 00:35:11,580
Any sample of a student’s
behavior, is an assessment.
763
00:35:11,580 –> 00:35:14,430
So. for example, not too
long ago I was working
764
00:35:14,430 –> 00:35:18,840
with a youngster and his
team, doing an evaluation.
765
00:35:18,840 –> 00:35:20,500
And, one of the things came up with,
766
00:35:20,500 –> 00:35:22,590
well, he was the youngster
767
00:35:22,590 –> 00:35:24,873
who was on the Autism Spectrum Disorder,
768
00:35:25,888 –> 00:35:30,330
and, however, was very interested in,
769
00:35:30,330 –> 00:35:32,670
and he was in high school,
he was a high school student,
770
00:35:32,670 –> 00:35:34,980
very interested in making
connections with his peers.
771
00:35:34,980 –> 00:35:39,300
And, when he did so, he
would do it nose to nose,
772
00:35:39,300 –> 00:35:41,670
which is kind of creepy for
most high school students.
773
00:35:41,670 –> 00:35:44,328
So, we had to work with
this student to talk about
774
00:35:44,328 –> 00:35:48,000
the body bubble, a little
imaginary circle around us.
775
00:35:48,000 –> 00:35:49,020
And, that didn’t work.
776
00:35:49,020 –> 00:35:52,860
So, then we decided the
floors in that school,
777
00:35:52,860 –> 00:35:56,670
were made out of these one
foot by one foot tiles.
778
00:35:56,670 –> 00:35:59,910
And, we said, “okay, here’s
what we’re gonna do, Elwood,
779
00:35:59,910 –> 00:36:02,700
these three, you have to be
three tiles away from a student
780
00:36:02,700 –> 00:36:04,680
when you stop to talk to them.
781
00:36:04,680 –> 00:36:07,080
And, so one of the assessment
strategies we picked up
782
00:36:07,080 –> 00:36:10,440
was just that he had a support person
783
00:36:10,440 –> 00:36:12,780
who was in the area
most of the school day,
784
00:36:12,780 –> 00:36:14,670
is that person would
just take, had a sheet,
785
00:36:14,670 –> 00:36:17,100
would take a look, and when he made it,
786
00:36:17,100 –> 00:36:18,960
an introduction to a student,
787
00:36:18,960 –> 00:36:20,400
they checked to see if it was a three.
788
00:36:20,400 –> 00:36:21,600
That’s an assessment tool.
789
00:36:21,600 –> 00:36:24,260
Is he three feet from, we can
determine if not, and from,
790
00:36:24,260 –> 00:36:28,440
that’s a very basic one, but
they can become very complex
791
00:36:28,440 –> 00:36:32,280
and very sophisticated, depending
on what we’re looking at.
792
00:36:32,280 –> 00:36:35,003
So, assessment tool, or
strategy, is any sample
793
00:36:35,003 –> 00:36:37,260
of a student’s behavior.
794
00:36:37,260 –> 00:36:40,113
Okay, so, let me look at the time.
795
00:36:43,560 –> 00:36:45,750
We have three minutes
before a quick break, but,
796
00:36:45,750 –> 00:36:48,030
so I wanna talk a little bit
about the different types
797
00:36:48,030 –> 00:36:49,890
of assessments that are
out there, ’cause sometimes
798
00:36:49,890 –> 00:36:53,010
we get mixed up on what
they actually mean.
799
00:36:53,010 –> 00:36:55,150
So, a standardized assessment,
800
00:36:55,150 –> 00:37:00,150
really means that it has
rules that we must follow,
801
00:37:00,270 –> 00:37:04,650
in terms of administration and scoring.
802
00:37:04,650 –> 00:37:06,870
And, if those of you have done this,
803
00:37:06,870 –> 00:37:09,840
will have notice a pattern,
that everything that we need
804
00:37:09,840 –> 00:37:12,330
to say, typically, is in bold blueprint,
805
00:37:12,330 –> 00:37:15,120
and we cannot deviate from what that says.
806
00:37:15,120 –> 00:37:16,800
It gives, it will typically provide us,
807
00:37:16,800 –> 00:37:17,820
what are the correct answers?
808
00:37:17,820 –> 00:37:18,900
What are the incorrect answers?
809
00:37:18,900 –> 00:37:22,980
We can’t deviate from that.
We gotta be fairly strict.
810
00:37:22,980 –> 00:37:25,830
And so, standardized
means, basically means,
811
00:37:25,830 –> 00:37:30,830
that if I administer the test,
or you administer the test,
812
00:37:31,770 –> 00:37:33,450
we both do it in the same way.
813
00:37:33,450 –> 00:37:37,230
We both score it, and then
come up with the same results.
814
00:37:37,230 –> 00:37:40,650
That’s also known as
inter-rater reliability.
815
00:37:40,650 –> 00:37:45,650
That, and so the more, the
better standardized the tests
816
00:37:46,623 –> 00:37:48,870
that we have, the more,
817
00:37:48,870 –> 00:37:51,578
the better our inter-rater reliability,
818
00:37:51,578 –> 00:37:54,400
we’re gonna talk a little
bit about, in a bit,
819
00:37:54,400 –> 00:37:56,943
about error and assessment.
820
00:37:58,350 –> 00:38:01,290
The greatest source of
error, in every assessment,
821
00:38:01,290 –> 00:38:03,570
for every measurement, is you and me.
822
00:38:03,570 –> 00:38:06,540
And so, we have to be careful to attend
823
00:38:06,540 –> 00:38:09,300
to the standardized procedures and test.
824
00:38:09,300 –> 00:38:13,260
Having said that, when we
get into the cross-battery
825
00:38:13,260 –> 00:38:15,840
approach, we’re gonna,
there’re gonna be times
826
00:38:15,840 –> 00:38:19,560
when it’s okay to deviate
from the standardized piece
827
00:38:19,560 –> 00:38:23,130
if we believe it’s gonna provide
us with useful information,
828
00:38:23,130 –> 00:38:25,230
and if it doesn’t change
829
00:38:25,230 –> 00:38:27,570
what the test is actually measuring.
830
00:38:27,570 –> 00:38:30,420
So, here’s a good example
of what we shouldn’t do.
831
00:38:30,420 –> 00:38:34,530
So, suppose we’re measuring
a reading assessment,
832
00:38:34,530 –> 00:38:37,650
and we wanna measure
reading comprehension,
833
00:38:37,650 –> 00:38:41,583
and the youngster’s having
difficulty reading the test.
834
00:38:42,601 –> 00:38:44,347
So, what we decide to do is,
835
00:38:44,347 –> 00:38:46,410
“well, I’m gonna read the test to them,
836
00:38:46,410 –> 00:38:48,806
and see they comprehend what we measure,
837
00:38:48,806 –> 00:38:51,240
what we’ve read, and then the test.”
838
00:38:51,240 –> 00:38:53,354
So, let’s make believe we’re using
839
00:38:53,354 –> 00:38:54,187
the Gray Oral Reading Test.
840
00:38:54,187 –> 00:38:56,460
So, the test comes with a
number of multiple choice
841
00:38:56,460 –> 00:38:57,600
answers/questions.
842
00:38:57,600 –> 00:38:58,980
I would pose those and all that.
843
00:38:58,980 –> 00:39:02,190
Well, that’s a nice accommodation,
but now what we’re doing
844
00:39:02,190 –> 00:39:04,830
is now we’re measuring
listening comprehension, right?
845
00:39:04,830 –> 00:39:06,060
We’re not measuring reading.
846
00:39:06,060 –> 00:39:08,970
So, there’s a time where
we might want to do that
847
00:39:08,970 –> 00:39:12,420
and it would be okay,
but we have to recognize
848
00:39:12,420 –> 00:39:15,870
that we’re no longer measuring
reading comprehension,
849
00:39:15,870 –> 00:39:18,510
we’re reading, we’re measuring
listening comprehension.
850
00:39:18,510 –> 00:39:20,430
And, there might be a time
where we wanna know that,
851
00:39:20,430 –> 00:39:22,350
and we happen to have a
Gray Oral Reading Test,
852
00:39:22,350 –> 00:39:23,970
and yeah, this would fit nicely.
853
00:39:23,970 –> 00:39:25,647
And so there are times that,
854
00:39:25,647 –> 00:39:28,260
and that’s kind of the basis
of the cross-battery approach
855
00:39:28,260 –> 00:39:29,790
where we’re gonna make some adjustments,
856
00:39:29,790 –> 00:39:32,280
but (clears throat) we’re
gonna do it in such a way,
857
00:39:32,280 –> 00:39:36,210
that we can get some valid results.
858
00:39:36,210 –> 00:39:39,720
Do you, are you doing
anything in districts anymore,
859
00:39:39,720 –> 00:39:41,901
or are you just, so you sound pretty busy.
860
00:39:41,901 –> 00:39:45,063
I am not doing stuff, in district stuff.
861
00:39:46,410 –> 00:39:51,410
I’ve got, I’m helping out in
the community where I live
862
00:39:51,480 –> 00:39:55,770
because they needed someone
in an emergency situation
863
00:39:55,770 –> 00:39:58,513
and that’s, (laughs) I
kinda, between you and I,
864
00:39:58,513 –> 00:40:01,142
I wish I hadn’t involved,
but I’m doing it,
865
00:40:01,142 –> 00:40:01,975
and it’s working out okay.
866
00:40:01,975 –> 00:40:03,745
So, that’s keeping me busy.
867
00:40:03,745 –> 00:40:05,518
So I have one district,
I’m helping them out.
868
00:40:05,518 –> 00:40:08,760
And then, between the, I’ve
cut back between the teaching
869
00:40:08,760 –> 00:40:11,869
and yeah, I’m a cub leader now, and I’m,
870
00:40:11,869 –> 00:40:13,019
oh wow,
871
00:40:13,019 –> 00:40:15,750
I’m doing all these other
things, so. (chuckles)
872
00:40:15,750 –> 00:40:17,100
Yeah, you sound pretty busy.
873
00:40:17,100 –> 00:40:20,474
I figured that, but yeah,
I just wondered, because,
874
00:40:20,474 –> 00:40:23,790
you know, if the community that you’re in,
875
00:40:23,790 –> 00:40:25,090
that you’re talking about,
876
00:40:25,980 –> 00:40:28,230
that can be mirrored across
the state of Vermont,
877
00:40:28,230 –> 00:40:29,670
you know that, right?
878
00:40:29,670 –> 00:40:30,963
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
879
00:40:30,963 –> 00:40:32,730
And, so when you say all these things,
880
00:40:32,730 –> 00:40:36,111
it’s, these are all the idealistic.
881
00:40:36,111 –> 00:40:37,500
Yeah.
882
00:40:37,500 –> 00:40:39,540
[Educator] But, not the reality.
883
00:40:39,540 –> 00:40:40,380
That’s a good point.
884
00:40:40,380 –> 00:40:43,740
That this is us doing
the right thing if we,
885
00:40:43,740 –> 00:40:46,230
that hopefully we have
the resources to do it.
886
00:40:46,230 –> 00:40:47,070
Right?
887
00:40:47,070 –> 00:40:49,620
Yeah, that’s a good point.
888
00:40:49,620 –> 00:40:52,470
The upside of that, is that,
889
00:40:52,470 –> 00:40:55,710
that means that someone’s
paying attention to the research
890
00:40:55,710 –> 00:40:57,600
and the evidence, and suggesting that,
891
00:40:57,600 –> 00:41:00,540
hmm, that maybe it’s true with everything.
892
00:41:00,540 –> 00:41:04,200
Something we thought was
a good idea 10 years ago,
893
00:41:04,200 –> 00:41:06,750
maybe isn’t such a good idea after all,
894
00:41:06,750 –> 00:41:09,140
and that the research isn’t supporting it,
895
00:41:09,140 –> 00:41:12,090
to the degree that we
thought it might often go.
896
00:41:12,090 –> 00:41:14,310
So, it’s a pain in neck
that, like you say,
897
00:41:14,310 –> 00:41:15,900
to have this storeroom full of the stuff,
898
00:41:15,900 –> 00:41:18,551
but the other end, okay,
it causes us, okay,
899
00:41:18,551 –> 00:41:21,210
what’s the more robust
way to deal with the,
900
00:41:21,210 –> 00:41:24,043
our literacy efforts.
901
00:41:24,043 –> 00:41:26,635
So, I just wanna go through
these different types
902
00:41:26,635 –> 00:41:29,775
of assessors because they create
problems for us sometimes,
903
00:41:29,775 –> 00:41:31,921
if people don’t fully
understand what they are.
904
00:41:31,921 –> 00:41:34,569
And, that’s one of the
things that came up,
905
00:41:34,569 –> 00:41:38,160
that I see in experience in team meetings.
906
00:41:38,160 –> 00:41:39,240
And, I would just wanna go through.
907
00:41:39,240 –> 00:41:41,850
So, our next, kind of,
test is what’s known as
908
00:41:41,850 –> 00:41:43,369
a norm-referenced test.
909
00:41:43,369 –> 00:41:47,818
Norm-reference tests are
almost always standardized.
910
00:41:47,818 –> 00:41:50,839
So, that means that you
gotta follow the rules.
911
00:41:50,839 –> 00:41:53,490
You gotta score it the
correct way they say,
912
00:41:53,490 –> 00:41:55,230
you gotta use the language they say,
913
00:41:55,230 –> 00:41:58,320
you gotta administer it in
the way that they prescribe.
914
00:41:58,320 –> 00:42:01,230
So, norm-reference
tests give you a measure
915
00:42:01,230 –> 00:42:04,830
of a student’s relative
standing within the group.
916
00:42:04,830 –> 00:42:07,649
And so, whoever’s in the norm,
917
00:42:07,649 –> 00:42:12,390
most of these tests have
an average score of 100,
918
00:42:12,390 –> 00:42:15,600
and a standard deviation, and
we’ll talk about that, of 15.
919
00:42:15,600 –> 00:42:17,850
Standard deviation, a
way to think about that,
920
00:42:17,850 –> 00:42:22,260
is that standard difference
or average difference.
921
00:42:22,260 –> 00:42:26,010
So, most of them have a
standard deviation of 15.
922
00:42:26,010 –> 00:42:31,010
And so, that means it’s okay
to be 15 points difference
923
00:42:32,100 –> 00:42:33,690
in one way or the other.
924
00:42:33,690 –> 00:42:37,710
So, for example, the score
would be 15 points below
925
00:42:37,710 –> 00:42:41,105
the mean, which is 100, would
be 85, and 15 points above
926
00:42:41,105 –> 00:42:44,910
the mean, would be 118.
927
00:42:44,910 –> 00:42:46,860
115, ah, sorry, caught me on my math.
928
00:42:46,860 –> 00:42:49,860
And so, that defines, statistically,
929
00:42:49,860 –> 00:42:51,210
the average range.
930
00:42:51,210 –> 00:42:52,820
And so, the test,
931
00:42:52,820 –> 00:42:54,930
so that’s gonna be
important when we talk about
932
00:42:54,930 –> 00:42:56,133
sharing out results,
933
00:42:57,579 –> 00:42:59,160
because sometimes parents
are gonna hear numbers
934
00:42:59,160 –> 00:43:00,600
that don’t make sense.
935
00:43:00,600 –> 00:43:05,600
And so, norm-referenced,
you’re compared to other people
936
00:43:06,853 –> 00:43:08,160
in the norm sample.
937
00:43:08,160 –> 00:43:09,423
Now here’s the biggie,
938
00:43:11,160 –> 00:43:15,540
is the youngster sitting
across from me in the sample?
939
00:43:15,540 –> 00:43:18,480
If the answer is “no,”
that is probably not
940
00:43:18,480 –> 00:43:23,193
an appropriate test to use
for a high-stakes decision,
941
00:43:24,750 –> 00:43:26,043
like eligibility.
942
00:43:26,910 –> 00:43:28,530
But, having said that,
943
00:43:28,530 –> 00:43:30,540
if we start a cross-battery approach,
944
00:43:30,540 –> 00:43:34,110
and we’re starting to look for ways
945
00:43:34,110 –> 00:43:37,440
to reliably measure someone’s skills,
946
00:43:37,440 –> 00:43:38,977
we might make an exception to say,
947
00:43:38,977 –> 00:43:41,070
“okay, we’re gonna, so
it’s a case by case basis,
948
00:43:41,070 –> 00:43:44,280
so we might use this,
a portion of this test,
949
00:43:44,280 –> 00:43:47,760
even though this youngster
isn’t in the norm sample,
950
00:43:47,760 –> 00:43:51,363
because it might provide us
with some valuable information.
951
00:43:52,289 –> 00:43:55,080
Here’s where it’s gonna
get a little complicated
952
00:43:55,080 –> 00:43:58,080
for mom, and dad, and even some teachers.
953
00:43:58,080 –> 00:44:01,500
So, when we’re reporting results out.
954
00:44:01,500 –> 00:44:03,333
So, one thing we do,
955
00:44:05,048 –> 00:44:08,370
if a youngster is having
multiple domains assessed,
956
00:44:08,370 –> 00:44:11,790
so we’re administering the
youngster’s cognitive skills,
957
00:44:11,790 –> 00:44:13,747
but we also suspect that,
958
00:44:13,747 –> 00:44:17,670
“I wonder if he has an
attention deficit disorder.”
959
00:44:17,670 –> 00:44:22,530
So, we might be administering
some behavioral assessments.
960
00:44:22,530 –> 00:44:26,220
And, those behavioral assessments
that psychologists use,
961
00:44:26,220 –> 00:44:30,750
have a mean of 50, and a
standard deviation of 10.
962
00:44:30,750 –> 00:44:35,017
So, that means on one hand,
I might say to a parent,
963
00:44:35,017 –> 00:44:39,613
“your youngster has a
score of 60 on this test
964
00:44:42,180 –> 00:44:43,170
of cognitive abilities,
965
00:44:43,170 –> 00:44:45,570
which suggests significant impairment.
966
00:44:45,570 –> 00:44:50,570
And, on this other test
he had of self-regulation,
967
00:44:51,060 –> 00:44:54,454
he has a test score of 60, which means,
968
00:44:54,454 –> 00:44:57,031
which is a standard,
which is above the mean,
969
00:44:57,031 –> 00:44:58,372
which is a good thing, which
means he has good regulation.”
970
00:44:58,372 –> 00:45:01,087
“Well, wait a minute,”
mom, his dad is saying,
971
00:45:01,087 –> 00:45:03,053
“how can these two scores of 60 and 60
972
00:45:03,053 –> 00:45:04,800
have such different meanings?”
973
00:45:04,800 –> 00:45:07,350
So, when we are reporting out results,
974
00:45:07,350 –> 00:45:10,260
see, we have to be really
careful to explain to the parents
975
00:45:10,260 –> 00:45:13,860
what the scores are,
and what’s the metric,
976
00:45:13,860 –> 00:45:16,288
what does that metric mean? So.
977
00:45:16,288 –> 00:45:21,288
When you say that, for
the norm-reference tests,
978
00:45:22,929 –> 00:45:23,762
that they’re not gonna work for students,
979
00:45:23,762 –> 00:45:25,050
that are not within the norm.
980
00:45:25,050 –> 00:45:27,330
Like, are you just talking
about students with, like,
981
00:45:27,330 –> 00:45:29,738
low incidence disabilities?
982
00:45:29,738 –> 00:45:31,871
Or, would it be, like, any
student with a disability? Like.
983
00:45:31,871 –> 00:45:35,220
No, it could be a student
who is a new American,
984
00:45:35,220 –> 00:45:39,605
from the Republic of,
you know, from Africa,
985
00:45:39,605 –> 00:45:41,550
one of the countries in Africa.
986
00:45:41,550 –> 00:45:43,410
That person’s not gonna
be in a norm-sample.
987
00:45:43,410 –> 00:45:48,000
So, it’s a general guidance,
988
00:45:48,000 –> 00:45:50,400
that you wanna be sure
that the person sitting
989
00:45:50,400 –> 00:45:52,320
across from you, is in the norm-sample,
990
00:45:52,320 –> 00:45:54,690
if you’re gonna use that for a high-stake.
991
00:45:54,690 –> 00:45:57,990
So, it’s true of kids who are bilingual,
992
00:45:57,990 –> 00:46:00,958
who are coming in, who might
not be in the norm-sample.
993
00:46:00,958 –> 00:46:03,903
And so, in that case,
994
00:46:04,773 –> 00:46:07,293
you’re gonna be really
careful of how to use.
995
00:46:08,172 –> 00:46:09,480
I’m not suggesting that,
996
00:46:09,480 –> 00:46:11,190
there might be a portion of that test,
997
00:46:11,190 –> 00:46:14,070
that might be valuable, to
yield some valuable information,
998
00:46:14,070 –> 00:46:16,727
but we would use it through that lens
999
00:46:16,727 –> 00:46:19,110
that it’s not totally
reflective of who he is,
1000
00:46:19,110 –> 00:46:20,850
because there’s no one in that norm-sample
1001
00:46:20,850 –> 00:46:22,100
that’s to be compared to.
1002
00:46:23,007 –> 00:46:24,420
But, we might still gain some information
1003
00:46:24,420 –> 00:46:26,910
because they can do this
task, if you know what I mean,
1004
00:46:26,910 –> 00:46:30,330
that we’ve determined that
they’re able to perform this,
1005
00:46:30,330 –> 00:46:32,580
and that might just be enough for us,
1006
00:46:32,580 –> 00:46:35,160
to give us some useful information.
1007
00:46:35,160 –> 00:46:36,593
[Educator] Okay, thank you.
1008
00:46:37,851 –> 00:46:39,090
Okay. Hey, thanks for the question.
1009
00:46:39,090 –> 00:46:40,380
That worked out perfectly.
1010
00:46:40,380 –> 00:46:41,640
I can even see you and everything.
1011
00:46:41,640 –> 00:46:42,993
Great, thanks. All right.
1012
00:46:44,319 –> 00:46:47,437
So, norm-reference, it’s telling you
1013
00:46:47,437 –> 00:46:50,070
“where do you, where is
this individual sitting
1014
00:46:50,070 –> 00:46:53,430
in front of you, stand
relative to the everyone else
1015
00:46:53,430 –> 00:46:55,378
in the norm sample.
1016
00:46:55,378 –> 00:46:56,880
And, it’s typically, the average range,
1017
00:46:56,880 –> 00:46:59,940
is typically defined as
one standard deviation
1018
00:46:59,940 –> 00:47:00,990
above the mean, one below.
1019
00:47:00,990 –> 00:47:03,478
85, they’re at 115, okay?
1020
00:47:03,478 –> 00:47:05,220
Criterion.
1021
00:47:05,220 –> 00:47:08,730
Any question, other questions
about norm-reference tests?
1022
00:47:08,730 –> 00:47:11,520
Okay, criterion reference tests,
1023
00:47:11,520 –> 00:47:15,409
are tests where somebody has decided
1024
00:47:15,409 –> 00:47:18,930
this is what you should be able to do,
1025
00:47:18,930 –> 00:47:23,040
if you are a certain age,
a certain grade level,
1026
00:47:23,040 –> 00:47:27,480
and they, typically, will order them,
1027
00:47:27,480 –> 00:47:29,790
in a developmental fashion.
1028
00:47:29,790 –> 00:47:34,790
And, what will happen is,
when you assess the student,
1029
00:47:35,683 –> 00:47:38,250
their raw score then gets compared
1030
00:47:38,250 –> 00:47:39,780
to somewhere on that continuum.
1031
00:47:39,780 –> 00:47:44,450
And, they usually yield
a developmental score,
1032
00:47:44,450 –> 00:47:47,820
an age equivalent score, or
a grade equivalent score.
1033
00:47:47,820 –> 00:47:51,321
Or, sometimes, now they’re being
a little more sophisticated
1034
00:47:51,321 –> 00:47:54,144
and they’ll call it proficient
and they’ll have other terms.
1035
00:47:54,144 –> 00:47:56,032
They’re proficient or nearly proficient,
1036
00:47:56,032 –> 00:47:58,620
whatever it might be.
1037
00:47:58,620 –> 00:48:03,620
Now, here’s where we run into
trouble in our EPT meetings,
1038
00:48:04,350 –> 00:48:05,820
educational planning team meetings.
1039
00:48:05,820 –> 00:48:07,911
We’re reporting out results, on norm,
1040
00:48:07,911 –> 00:48:11,280
so here’s one, something
that happens frequently,
1041
00:48:11,280 –> 00:48:16,280
we’ve administered a
norm-reference writing assessment,
1042
00:48:16,740 –> 00:48:17,573
okay?
1043
00:48:17,573 –> 00:48:21,780
And, the youngster’s score
falls within the average range.
1044
00:48:21,780 –> 00:48:24,993
We’ll say it’s a 90, it’s a 95.
1045
00:48:26,298 –> 00:48:31,298
But, then this classroom
teacher has been administering
1046
00:48:32,370 –> 00:48:35,970
assessments that are
based on the national,
1047
00:48:35,970 –> 00:48:38,010
or the state standards,
1048
00:48:38,010 –> 00:48:40,530
that have criterion that are listed,
1049
00:48:40,530 –> 00:48:45,530
that a group of experts
believed students should be able
1050
00:48:46,710 –> 00:48:50,310
to do, at that point in time.
1051
00:48:50,310 –> 00:48:53,817
And so those are usually ambitious.
1052
00:48:56,040 –> 00:48:57,930
Those are, and that’s not a bad thing.
1053
00:48:57,930 –> 00:49:00,392
We’re gonna talk about goal setting,
1054
00:49:00,392 –> 00:49:03,180
and if we set ambitious goals
and, put high expectations,
1055
00:49:03,180 –> 00:49:06,556
both on the youngster and
ourselves, to achieve those goals,
1056
00:49:06,556 –> 00:49:08,490
but they don’t match.
1057
00:49:08,490 –> 00:49:10,950
So, what will happen is you’ll
be reporting our results,
1058
00:49:10,950 –> 00:49:15,368
and the classroom teacher
will become, (chuckles)
1059
00:49:15,368 –> 00:49:17,674
somewhat upset because, “wait a minute,
1060
00:49:17,674 –> 00:49:21,545
I’ve been administering all
these assessments in class,
1061
00:49:21,545 –> 00:49:23,190
and he can barely do,” da da da.
1062
00:49:23,190 –> 00:49:26,972
And, they’ll see a huge
distinction between the two.
1063
00:49:26,972 –> 00:49:31,509
And so, what the difference is,
is in a norm-reference test,
1064
00:49:31,509 –> 00:49:34,490
the youngster is performing,
1065
00:49:34,490 –> 00:49:37,860
relative to what other
kids that youngster’s age
1066
00:49:37,860 –> 00:49:40,200
could really, actually do.
1067
00:49:40,200 –> 00:49:43,560
That’s what they really,
actually did during this test.
1068
00:49:43,560 –> 00:49:45,720
And, our criterion reference test,
1069
00:49:45,720 –> 00:49:49,920
the youngsters being compared
to what some experts decided
1070
00:49:49,920 –> 00:49:53,013
the youngster should be
able to do at that point.
1071
00:49:53,850 –> 00:49:57,360
And so, it sometimes can be arbitrary,
1072
00:49:57,360 –> 00:49:59,100
but it’s typically,
they’re typically developed
1073
00:49:59,100 –> 00:50:00,960
by a group of experts in the area.
1074
00:50:00,960 –> 00:50:03,162
So, do you see the difference there,
1075
00:50:03,162 –> 00:50:05,790
and how that can create some confusion
1076
00:50:05,790 –> 00:50:08,513
when we’re reporting out results? Okay.
1077
00:50:10,290 –> 00:50:14,700
Okay, criterion
curriculum-based assessments,
1078
00:50:14,700 –> 00:50:16,164
I’m gonna give you an example
1079
00:50:16,164 –> 00:50:19,140
of what one of these looks
like, is an assessment
1080
00:50:19,140 –> 00:50:21,360
that is typically a
classroom-based assessment,
1081
00:50:21,360 –> 00:50:23,725
but as special educators
you might do them, as well.
1082
00:50:23,725 –> 00:50:28,710
And, what it does is it takes
a look at the instruction
1083
00:50:28,710 –> 00:50:31,920
we’ve been providing
over the period of time,
1084
00:50:31,920 –> 00:50:34,350
and then assesses those skills that,
1085
00:50:34,350 –> 00:50:36,610
so let’s say it’s a four-week period.
1086
00:50:36,610 –> 00:50:39,900
I’ve been providing math
instruction over a four-week period
1087
00:50:39,900 –> 00:50:42,547
and I have assessed these various skills.
1088
00:50:42,547 –> 00:50:46,530
So, I administer an
assessment to my class,
1089
00:50:46,530 –> 00:50:51,510
and everyone takes the assessment,
and I review the results.
1090
00:50:51,510 –> 00:50:53,820
And I noticed that “ah,
everyone’s doing pretty good,”
1091
00:50:53,820 –> 00:50:58,440
except for this aspect of
math that I was teaching.
1092
00:50:58,440 –> 00:51:03,440
So, that tells me I need to
go back and teach that piece,
1093
00:51:04,200 –> 00:51:07,110
again, as well as continue through
1094
00:51:07,110 –> 00:51:11,070
whatever my scope and sequences
of my math instruction.
1095
00:51:11,070 –> 00:51:13,500
And, then the next
month, again, when I do,
1096
00:51:13,500 –> 00:51:15,780
or two weeks, whenever I do my assessment,
1097
00:51:15,780 –> 00:51:20,760
I’m gonna include that element
on that assessment again,
1098
00:51:20,760 –> 00:51:22,650
along with any new
elements that I’ve taught
1099
00:51:22,650 –> 00:51:23,670
over that month.
1100
00:51:23,670 –> 00:51:26,310
And so, it’s a recursive
way to let me know,
1101
00:51:26,310 –> 00:51:29,099
is our youngsters keeping track,
1102
00:51:29,099 –> 00:51:32,370
keeping up with the
instruction I’m providing?
1103
00:51:32,370 –> 00:51:34,380
And, it gives me information to go back,
1104
00:51:34,380 –> 00:51:37,800
and provide supplemental, or
different kind of instruction
1105
00:51:37,800 –> 00:51:40,620
if the group of students are
not getting a particular piece
1106
00:51:40,620 –> 00:51:43,230
rather than continuing to plow forward
1107
00:51:43,230 –> 00:51:45,183
and leave those kids behind.
1108
00:51:46,035 –> 00:51:49,350
So, and again, if any questions pop up
1109
00:51:49,350 –> 00:51:52,113
about any of these tests,
don’t hesitate to ask.
1110
00:51:53,133 –> 00:51:54,990
I’m gonna give an example.
1111
00:51:54,990 –> 00:51:57,030
I have an example of
what that might look like
1112
00:51:57,030 –> 00:51:58,965
when we get to another slide.
1113
00:51:58,965 –> 00:52:01,980
Curriculum-based measurement,
they sound the same,
1114
00:52:01,980 –> 00:52:03,780
but they’re very different.
1115
00:52:03,780 –> 00:52:05,580
What curriculum-based measurements are,
1116
00:52:05,580 –> 00:52:09,833
these are assessments that
look at underlying skills
1117
00:52:10,701 –> 00:52:15,660
that you need to be successful
to complete a terminal skill.
1118
00:52:15,660 –> 00:52:19,430
So, the most commonly occurring CBMs,
1119
00:52:19,430 –> 00:52:21,570
or curriculum-based measurements,
that we’re gonna see,
1120
00:52:21,570 –> 00:52:23,220
are earned in the area of reading.
1121
00:52:23,220 –> 00:52:26,070
So, in order to be a good reader,
1122
00:52:26,070 –> 00:52:27,660
you need to know your letter names.
1123
00:52:27,660 –> 00:52:29,986
So, there’ll be a
curriculum-based measurement
1124
00:52:29,986 –> 00:52:32,910
for letter names, and
they’re always timed,
1125
00:52:32,910 –> 00:52:36,060
because if you can do something
quickly and accurately,
1126
00:52:36,060 –> 00:52:37,590
it means that you’ve mastered the thing.
1127
00:52:37,590 –> 00:52:39,150
So, the skill.
1128
00:52:39,150 –> 00:52:41,910
And so, they’ll have measures of letter,
1129
00:52:41,910 –> 00:52:43,836
and then we progress.
1130
00:52:43,836 –> 00:52:46,170
“Okay, can you say letter sounds?”
1131
00:52:46,170 –> 00:52:48,483
Then we move on to that,
and then we progress.
1132
00:52:48,483 –> 00:52:51,325
And, the next curriculum-based
assessment might be,
1133
00:52:51,325 –> 00:52:56,325
“can you read CVC words,” and on and on.
1134
00:52:56,577 –> 00:53:01,577
And so, these are, we’re gonna
see in a little slide, later.
1135
00:53:01,648 –> 00:53:03,060
These are actually,
1136
00:53:03,060 –> 00:53:05,940
curriculum-based measures
are really good for measuring
1137
00:53:05,940 –> 00:53:07,530
progress, if we have setting up.
1138
00:53:07,530 –> 00:53:09,425
So, that’s our, one of our goals, is we,
1139
00:53:09,425 –> 00:53:13,170
is Elwood needs to learn the letter sounds
1140
00:53:13,170 –> 00:53:15,270
associated with each letter,
1141
00:53:15,270 –> 00:53:17,805
and then with graphemes,
and things like that.
1142
00:53:17,805 –> 00:53:22,805
Then, you could use these
to measure your growth
1143
00:53:23,280 –> 00:53:24,360
along the way.
1144
00:53:24,360 –> 00:53:26,730
And, the other thing, and
when we look at the slide
1145
00:53:26,730 –> 00:53:29,190
that delineates this there frequently,
1146
00:53:29,190 –> 00:53:30,810
and it’s recommended that the results be
1147
00:53:30,810 –> 00:53:32,220
graphically represented,
1148
00:53:32,220 –> 00:53:34,500
so that everyone can see what’s happening.
1149
00:53:34,500 –> 00:53:35,876
Okay. Alright.
1150
00:53:35,876 –> 00:53:37,692
And, we’ll look at those, called CBMs,
1151
00:53:37,692 –> 00:53:40,341
and there’s a lot of
commercially available ones,
1152
00:53:40,341 –> 00:53:43,020
but sometimes, people make
their own up, and we can,
1153
00:53:43,020 –> 00:53:44,935
we’ll kinda look at some of those.
1154
00:53:44,935 –> 00:53:48,031
Ecological assessment. This is the biggie.
1155
00:53:48,031 –> 00:53:53,031
I cannot conduct, I would
never conduct an evaluation
1156
00:53:53,820 –> 00:53:56,160
of a student without
observing that student
1157
00:53:56,160 –> 00:53:57,000
in the classroom.
1158
00:53:57,000 –> 00:53:59,610
That’s the most important environment,
1159
00:53:59,610 –> 00:54:01,680
in which this youngster functions.
1160
00:54:01,680 –> 00:54:04,080
So, we need to get in
there and take a peek
1161
00:54:04,080 –> 00:54:06,090
at, what’s the structure of the classroom?
1162
00:54:06,090 –> 00:54:07,556
How is instruction?
1163
00:54:07,556 –> 00:54:08,670
It’s just not the individual,
1164
00:54:08,670 –> 00:54:10,200
but what’s the whole environment though?
1165
00:54:10,200 –> 00:54:11,970
What’s the seating like?
1166
00:54:11,970 –> 00:54:16,970
How is the youngster-in-focus
responding to the instruction?
1167
00:54:17,220 –> 00:54:20,792
So, we wanna get right
within the environment,
1168
00:54:20,792 –> 00:54:23,790
and sometimes it’s,
that environment’s home.
1169
00:54:23,790 –> 00:54:26,310
I can sit you with my situation.
1170
00:54:26,310 –> 00:54:28,770
I laugh, because the
outcome is fairly funny,
1171
00:54:28,770 –> 00:54:33,770
is this whole situation,
it’s called selective mutism,
1172
00:54:33,990 –> 00:54:38,186
where you have youngsters
who will not talk in school,
1173
00:54:38,186 –> 00:54:39,780
or won’t talk.
1174
00:54:39,780 –> 00:54:42,233
And, more often than not
the parents will tell you
1175
00:54:42,233 –> 00:54:45,750
she’s a chatter box at home,
or he’s a chatterbox at home,
1176
00:54:45,750 –> 00:54:47,580
but will not talk at school.
1177
00:54:47,580 –> 00:54:48,847
So, one of the things I do is,
1178
00:54:48,847 –> 00:54:51,810
“okay, mom, what time does, you know,
1179
00:54:51,810 –> 00:54:53,077
Mary get home from school?”
1180
00:54:53,077 –> 00:54:55,027
“Well, she gets home from
school at two o’clock.”
1181
00:54:55,027 –> 00:54:56,805
“All right, can I come over
at two? I mean, at 1:45.”
1182
00:54:56,805 –> 00:55:00,508
So, I go in, I make myself
comfortable in a place
1183
00:55:00,508 –> 00:55:02,451
in the house, where the
youngster can’t see me.
1184
00:55:02,451 –> 00:55:06,870
She comes through the door,
yakking away, talking to mom,
1185
00:55:06,870 –> 00:55:09,348
she spots me, and then what happens?
1186
00:55:09,348 –> 00:55:11,700
She stops talking.
1187
00:55:11,700 –> 00:55:13,710
But, now we know this youngster
1188
00:55:13,710 –> 00:55:15,690
does not have communication issues,
1189
00:55:15,690 –> 00:55:17,010
does not have language issues.
1190
00:55:17,010 –> 00:55:20,910
It’s strictly the issues.
1191
00:55:20,910 –> 00:55:22,860
It’s considered to be
anxious about teachers
1192
00:55:22,860 –> 00:55:23,967
and talking at school.
1193
00:55:23,967 –> 00:55:27,300
And so, the ecological peace
then happened in the home.
1194
00:55:27,300 –> 00:55:29,070
Sometimes, we gotta get people on the bus.
1195
00:55:29,070 –> 00:55:30,600
what’s going on on the bus?
1196
00:55:30,600 –> 00:55:32,820
You know, you have youngsters
that were having difficulty
1197
00:55:32,820 –> 00:55:35,640
getting to the bus, getting
to and from school without
1198
00:55:35,640 –> 00:55:37,840
getting written up, or
whatever it might be.
1199
00:55:39,240 –> 00:55:42,870
Error analysis. This is hugely important.
1200
00:55:42,870 –> 00:55:45,210
If any of you have taken an
assessment course with me,
1201
00:55:45,210 –> 00:55:48,176
you know that I put a
huge emphasis on this.
1202
00:55:48,176 –> 00:55:52,950
It is no help for me to write on my report
1203
00:55:52,950 –> 00:55:57,437
that Elwood obtained a
score of 80 on this test
1204
00:55:57,437 –> 00:56:00,033
of math calculation.
1205
00:56:01,650 –> 00:56:05,070
So, 80 falls more than
the standard deviation
1206
00:56:05,070 –> 00:56:05,903
below the mean.
1207
00:56:05,903 –> 00:56:08,460
And, that’s how we define a deficit.
1208
00:56:08,460 –> 00:56:10,350
So, that’s a significant deficit.
1209
00:56:10,350 –> 00:56:12,701
It’s more than 15 points below the mean.
1210
00:56:12,701 –> 00:56:15,508
That’s not helpful to Emily as the teacher
1211
00:56:15,508 –> 00:56:18,200
who’s gonna be providing the instruction.
1212
00:56:18,200 –> 00:56:19,800
So, in my report,
1213
00:56:19,800 –> 00:56:22,590
I have to write what
the youngster could do,
1214
00:56:22,590 –> 00:56:23,700
and what they couldn’t do.
1215
00:56:23,700 –> 00:56:25,533
And, that’s what’s gonna
be in the report, so.
1216
00:56:25,533 –> 00:56:27,480
And, we need to ask for that.
1217
00:56:27,480 –> 00:56:30,209
So, when we, so part of when
we get into the educational
1218
00:56:30,209 –> 00:56:33,552
planning team meetings, and
what we need to do there,
1219
00:56:33,552 –> 00:56:36,900
it’s incumbent upon us,
to ask these questions,
1220
00:56:36,900 –> 00:56:38,670
so that we get their answers.
1221
00:56:38,670 –> 00:56:41,557
So, we’re gonna want our
evaluators, or if we’re,
1222
00:56:41,557 –> 00:56:44,480
if our colleagues and we’re
are on the team doing it,
1223
00:56:44,480 –> 00:56:47,878
we have to make sure that
we’re getting that information
1224
00:56:47,878 –> 00:56:48,973
to the people who need it,
1225
00:56:48,973 –> 00:56:50,340
the special educator and
the classroom teacher.
1226
00:56:50,340 –> 00:56:51,810
What could the youngster do?
1227
00:56:51,810 –> 00:56:53,370
What couldn’t they didn’t do?
1228
00:56:53,370 –> 00:56:57,153
And then, this also goes
towards IEP development, okay?
1229
00:56:57,153 –> 00:56:59,370
Of the things they couldn’t do,
1230
00:56:59,370 –> 00:57:01,875
what are the most
important to us as a team,
1231
00:57:01,875 –> 00:57:02,708
and what are we gonna focus on?
1232
00:57:02,708 –> 00:57:06,425
‘Cause frequently, you
can’t focus on everything.
1233
00:57:06,425 –> 00:57:09,235
Dynamic assessment is a broad term
1234
00:57:09,235 –> 00:57:13,890
for what we do when we’re
providing instruction
1235
00:57:13,890 –> 00:57:17,700
to a student, and we
watching what’s happening,
1236
00:57:17,700 –> 00:57:19,980
and we’re determining, “yep,
they’re making growth,”
1237
00:57:19,980 –> 00:57:22,020
or “this suggests evidence of growth.
1238
00:57:22,020 –> 00:57:23,430
This suggests evidence of growth,”
1239
00:57:23,430 –> 00:57:26,790
and we’re making adjustments
to our instruction
1240
00:57:26,790 –> 00:57:28,382
based on what’s happening there.
1241
00:57:28,382 –> 00:57:30,910
It’s, kind of, an ongoing process.
1242
00:57:34,587 –> 00:57:37,740
There are one or two tests on the market,
1243
00:57:37,740 –> 00:57:39,900
that, actually, we’re gonna,
we’ll look at one of them
1244
00:57:39,900 –> 00:57:41,962
that, actually, has incorporated into it,
1245
00:57:41,962 –> 00:57:46,020
a dynamic assessment piece,
whereby, during the evaluation,
1246
00:57:46,020 –> 00:57:49,590
the evaluator teaches
the youngster a skill,
1247
00:57:49,590 –> 00:57:52,140
or an activity they’ve never done before.
1248
00:57:52,140 –> 00:57:55,590
And then, we observe to see
how well they progressed
1249
00:57:55,590 –> 00:57:57,390
through that skill.
1250
00:57:57,390 –> 00:58:01,110
And so, they called
Controlled Learning Task,
1251
00:58:01,110 –> 00:58:03,627
where we’re teaching them
something they didn’t do,
1252
00:58:03,627 –> 00:58:06,900
and were gonna see what
they actually could do.
1253
00:58:06,900 –> 00:58:08,977
OK. Checklists.
1254
00:58:08,977 –> 00:58:13,530
Some of them are, these are, like,
1255
00:58:13,530 –> 00:58:15,810
appear some of them are norm-referenced,
1256
00:58:15,810 –> 00:58:18,060
some are just service guidance,
1257
00:58:18,060 –> 00:58:20,999
some of them of more criterion reference.
1258
00:58:20,999 –> 00:58:23,610
So, for example, I know the I-team
1259
00:58:23,610 –> 00:58:26,790
has a number of checklists
that I’ve reviewed,
1260
00:58:26,790 –> 00:58:30,300
that, whereby, they
provide a nice sequence of
1261
00:58:30,300 –> 00:58:32,343
what are the skills you need to have,
1262
00:58:33,614 –> 00:58:34,493
in order to be a mathematician?
1263
00:58:35,930 –> 00:58:37,591
What are the skills to be a reader?
1264
00:58:37,591 –> 00:58:39,144
And, you just can look at those and say,
1265
00:58:39,144 –> 00:58:40,585
“okay, what are the skills
that this youngster possesses,
1266
00:58:40,585 –> 00:58:42,810
and what are the ones that they don’t?”
1267
00:58:42,810 –> 00:58:46,238
And, then we can, it helps
us guide our instruction.
1268
00:58:46,238 –> 00:58:50,003
Other checklists are, kind
of, fall within the notions
1269
00:58:50,003 –> 00:58:53,373
of the same realm as
rating scales, whereby,
1270
00:58:56,340 –> 00:58:59,730
they tend to be norm-referenced,
and as I said earlier,
1271
00:58:59,730 –> 00:59:03,721
they’re gonna tend to
be, have a mean of 50.
1272
00:59:03,721 –> 00:59:05,910
So, the, if you get a score 50,
1273
00:59:05,910 –> 00:59:07,350
it means your right where you need to be
1274
00:59:07,350 –> 00:59:08,940
for someone your age,
1275
00:59:08,940 –> 00:59:11,610
and then with a standard
deviation of 10 on either side.
1276
00:59:11,610 –> 00:59:13,830
So, depending on the test,
1277
00:59:13,830 –> 00:59:15,900
a high score might mean
that you’re doing well,
1278
00:59:15,900 –> 00:59:18,960
or high point score might
mean you’re not doing well,
1279
00:59:18,960 –> 00:59:20,135
depends on the test.
1280
00:59:20,135 –> 00:59:23,130
We have rating skills
for all sorts of things,
1281
00:59:23,130 –> 00:59:26,073
anxiety, depression, attention.
1282
00:59:26,917 –> 00:59:29,190
So, they, it’s pretty typical
1283
00:59:29,190 –> 00:59:31,140
if you have a question about something,
1284
00:59:31,140 –> 00:59:33,480
that we’ll be able to find a rating skill
1285
00:59:33,480 –> 00:59:35,973
that would be appropriate
to the youngster.
1286
00:59:38,420 –> 00:59:39,621
And then, any kind of
student-centered assessments,
1287
00:59:39,621 –> 00:59:42,870
and those are similar to the
ecological assessment, whereby,
1288
00:59:42,870 –> 00:59:44,520
okay, I’ve been in here,
1289
00:59:44,520 –> 00:59:46,950
I’ve been scoping out the environment.
1290
00:59:46,950 –> 00:59:50,730
Now, I’m gonna scope out Elwood’s response
1291
00:59:50,730 –> 00:59:52,020
to instruction environment.
1292
00:59:52,020 –> 00:59:56,013
And, I typically will ask the
teacher, or your evaluator,
1293
00:59:57,853 –> 00:59:59,483
or yourself if you’re
doing, is to identify,
1294
01:00:00,962 –> 01:00:03,279
and this is, again, the
combining with observations,
1295
01:00:03,279 –> 01:00:07,080
identify a typical student,
so I can get a sense
1296
01:00:07,080 –> 01:00:10,920
for how is the
youngster-of-my-focus responding,
1297
01:00:10,920 –> 01:00:12,390
relative to a typical student.
1298
01:00:12,390 –> 01:00:15,045
Because, sometimes things go awry.
1299
01:00:15,045 –> 01:00:19,726
A teacher might be trying out a new unit,
1300
01:00:19,726 –> 01:00:21,870
and they’ve never done it before,
1301
01:00:21,870 –> 01:00:24,690
and before you know it,
it’s not going smoothly.
1302
01:00:24,690 –> 01:00:26,580
And, the entire class
is starting to lose it.
1303
01:00:26,580 –> 01:00:29,730
We’re losing, she’s losing the
focus and attention of said,
1304
01:00:29,730 –> 01:00:33,570
well, if it’s my student is
also losing attention and focus,
1305
01:00:33,570 –> 01:00:35,634
that wouldn’t count against them,
1306
01:00:35,634 –> 01:00:37,684
because it’s relative to the whole class.
1307
01:00:38,610 –> 01:00:42,213
And then, observations
refer to these, kind of,
1308
01:00:43,207 –> 01:00:45,407
student-centered, and
these ecological such.
1309
01:00:46,311 –> 01:00:47,280
But also, your time with an individual.
1310
01:00:47,280 –> 01:00:48,938
What have you noted?
1311
01:00:48,938 –> 01:00:51,120
What does this youngster
like? What do they dislike?
1312
01:00:51,120 –> 01:00:54,210
How do they, this is key.
1313
01:00:54,210 –> 01:00:58,076
When we get into the
cross-battery assessment piece,
1314
01:00:58,076 –> 01:01:01,080
we’re gonna look at the
steps that you need to do,
1315
01:01:01,080 –> 01:01:02,160
to conduct one of those.
1316
01:01:02,160 –> 01:01:05,220
And, one of the steps is
to get to know the student.
1317
01:01:05,220 –> 01:01:08,940
And so, I’m gonna be
really relying on Emily,
1318
01:01:08,940 –> 01:01:11,520
and the classroom students,
classroom teachers,
1319
01:01:11,520 –> 01:01:13,806
and the parents.
1320
01:01:13,806 –> 01:01:16,500
Help me get to know,
what have you observed?
1321
01:01:16,500 –> 01:01:18,420
What does the student
like? What they don’t like.
1322
01:01:18,420 –> 01:01:21,540
Is it preferable to
place visual information
1323
01:01:21,540 –> 01:01:23,670
to the right or to the left?
1324
01:01:23,670 –> 01:01:26,636
Is their hearing in one ear
stronger than the other ear?
1325
01:01:26,636 –> 01:01:28,590
Do they have more motor control
1326
01:01:28,590 –> 01:01:29,910
in the left arm versus the right?
1327
01:01:29,910 –> 01:01:31,620
All these different things
that you’ve observed
1328
01:01:31,620 –> 01:01:35,220
that are gonna help us
to provide an assessment
1329
01:01:35,220 –> 01:01:40,220
that’s fair, and does not tap into,
1330
01:01:40,910 –> 01:01:43,680
at the least possible
way, does not tap into
1331
01:01:43,680 –> 01:01:46,173
their actually diagnosed disability.
1332
01:01:47,130 –> 01:01:48,300
All right.
1333
01:01:48,300 –> 01:01:50,580
I suspect there are other
types of assessments,
1334
01:01:50,580 –> 01:01:53,400
but that’s a pretty darn
good list we got there.
1335
01:01:53,400 –> 01:01:56,700
All right, so things that can affect
1336
01:01:56,700 –> 01:01:58,473
the accurate assessment.
1337
01:01:59,916 –> 01:02:03,390
These are, seem like, some of
these might be no-brainers,
1338
01:02:03,390 –> 01:02:07,410
but I’ve seen people,
you know, psychologists,
1339
01:02:07,410 –> 01:02:08,550
to ignore these.
1340
01:02:08,550 –> 01:02:10,440
The ability of participant to understand
1341
01:02:10,440 –> 01:02:12,240
the assessment stimuli.
1342
01:02:12,240 –> 01:02:16,080
Yeah, if if they don’t get
what I’m asking you to do,
1343
01:02:16,080 –> 01:02:19,200
then that’s gonna be reflected
in their performance.
1344
01:02:19,200 –> 01:02:22,830
They’re gonna be responding
randomly, et cetera, et cetera.
1345
01:02:22,830 –> 01:02:27,180
So, that’s gonna be
the ability to respond.
1346
01:02:27,180 –> 01:02:30,390
So, if I have, if I’m
using the Wechsler scales,
1347
01:02:30,390 –> 01:02:32,040
one of the things you have to do,
1348
01:02:33,340 –> 01:02:34,340
is you have to take these little blocks,
1349
01:02:34,340 –> 01:02:36,407
and put them together as part of a measure
1350
01:02:36,407 –> 01:02:38,973
of your visual-spatial thinking skills.
1351
01:02:38,973 –> 01:02:42,000
And, if you’re affected by cerebral palsy,
1352
01:02:42,000 –> 01:02:44,682
and you have erratic movements,
it’s gonna take you longer.
1353
01:02:44,682 –> 01:02:48,737
And in fact, you lose points
if they’re not aligned
1354
01:02:48,737 –> 01:02:50,190
in a certain specific way.
1355
01:02:50,190 –> 01:02:51,889
That’s not a fair assessment.
1356
01:02:51,889 –> 01:02:54,420
Appropriate norm comparisons.
1357
01:02:54,420 –> 01:02:56,220
Again, as we talked about that earlier,
1358
01:02:56,220 –> 01:02:58,803
you wanna be sure that the
person that you’re evaluating
1359
01:02:58,803 –> 01:03:00,570
is in the norm sample.
1360
01:03:00,570 –> 01:03:04,050
And, I am pleased to say
that more and more tests
1361
01:03:04,050 –> 01:03:08,607
are broadening the scope of the
people in their norm sample.
1362
01:03:08,607 –> 01:03:12,180
And so, for example, one
of the things that I do,
1363
01:03:12,180 –> 01:03:13,890
I should’ve said this
earlier, I should’ve,
1364
01:03:13,890 –> 01:03:16,243
there’s a disclaimer, full disclosure.
1365
01:03:16,243 –> 01:03:21,243
I also have a relationship
with Riverside Publishing,
1366
01:03:21,840 –> 01:03:23,280
which publishes tests.
1367
01:03:23,280 –> 01:03:25,020
And, the reason I have a
relationship with them,
1368
01:03:25,020 –> 01:03:27,829
is because every test they publish
1369
01:03:27,829 –> 01:03:32,829
meets the highest levels
of (coughs) quality
1370
01:03:32,910 –> 01:03:34,560
that we’re looking for in tests,
1371
01:03:34,560 –> 01:03:36,690
which is why I’ve stuck
with them over the years.
1372
01:03:36,690 –> 01:03:38,640
It’s not to suggests I don’t
have other tests that I use,
1373
01:03:38,640 –> 01:03:42,067
but they tend, their tests
tend to be my go-to test.
1374
01:03:42,067 –> 01:03:47,067
So, one of the things, so I’m
involved in the development
1375
01:03:47,541 –> 01:03:51,270
and norming of the next
iteration of a group of tests
1376
01:03:51,270 –> 01:03:52,740
coming out of Riverside.
1377
01:03:52,740 –> 01:03:55,650
And, one of the things that I’ve noticed
1378
01:03:55,650 –> 01:03:57,412
they’re looking for,
1379
01:03:57,412 –> 01:04:00,376
they’re looking for children
who have a diagnosis of ADHD.
1380
01:04:00,376 –> 01:04:04,080
They’re looking for children
who have diagnosis of Autism.
1381
01:04:04,080 –> 01:04:09,080
They’re looking for students
who will broaden out the scope
1382
01:04:10,800 –> 01:04:13,080
of the norm sample, so that we can make,
1383
01:04:13,080 –> 01:04:16,080
we can feel more comfortable
about making norm comparisons
1384
01:04:16,080 –> 01:04:17,531
to that.
1385
01:04:17,531 –> 01:04:22,317
The appropriateness and
the level of the items.
1386
01:04:22,317 –> 01:04:25,200
And so, if we have a youngster,
1387
01:04:25,200 –> 01:04:27,840
and where we’re interested
in their math skills,
1388
01:04:27,840 –> 01:04:30,150
but the test that we’re using,
1389
01:04:30,150 –> 01:04:33,240
perhaps doesn’t go down low
enough to measure some of those
1390
01:04:33,240 –> 01:04:36,480
early fundamental skills,
then we might just get a score
1391
01:04:36,480 –> 01:04:38,160
that reflects the fact that they,
1392
01:04:38,160 –> 01:04:40,548
well, they don’t really have
these higher order skills,
1393
01:04:40,548 –> 01:04:44,220
and we don’t know if they
have these lower fundamental
1394
01:04:44,220 –> 01:04:46,800
skills that contribute to
your, to being a mathematician.
1395
01:04:46,800 –> 01:04:51,477
So, we need to look at,
okay, is the level is,
1396
01:04:51,477 –> 01:04:54,060
and also is the breadth.
1397
01:04:54,060 –> 01:04:56,820
Does it go high enough to look into,
1398
01:04:56,820 –> 01:04:59,530
to be sure that we’re challenging students
1399
01:05:00,404 –> 01:05:05,100
and getting into the areas
that they may have skill in.
1400
01:05:05,100 –> 01:05:06,630
One of the things I tell youngsters
1401
01:05:06,630 –> 01:05:08,356
whenever I’m working with them,
1402
01:05:08,356 –> 01:05:12,120
is that I tell ’em,
depends if it’s the middle,
1403
01:05:12,120 –> 01:05:14,377
so I was with a middle school
student this week, and I said,
1404
01:05:14,377 –> 01:05:16,650
“okay, see this, you see these books.
1405
01:05:16,650 –> 01:05:19,200
You don’t have to dare, you
don’t have to do everything
1406
01:05:20,340 –> 01:05:21,996
in these books.”
1407
01:05:21,996 –> 01:05:23,573
I’m gonna, I use these books
with middle school, elementary,
1408
01:05:24,688 –> 01:05:25,913
middle school, high school,
and even some college,
1409
01:05:27,167 –> 01:05:28,000
and we’re gonna do the
middle school stuff.
1410
01:05:28,000 –> 01:05:29,820
But, then one of the things I tell ’em,
1411
01:05:32,312 –> 01:05:36,120
is that middle school
students sometimes know stuff
1412
01:05:36,120 –> 01:05:37,713
that high school students know.
1413
01:05:38,827 –> 01:05:41,502
And so, “I’m gonna ask you
some high school stuff too,
1414
01:05:41,502 –> 01:05:42,335
and you’ll know I’m doing that,
1415
01:05:42,335 –> 01:05:43,950
because it’s gonna feel a little harder,
1416
01:05:43,950 –> 01:05:46,590
and that’s when I want
you to try your best.”
1417
01:05:46,590 –> 01:05:49,500
So, there’s a couple of reasons
why I’m telling ’em this.
1418
01:05:49,500 –> 01:05:52,125
One is that, the most
important one is that,
1419
01:05:52,125 –> 01:05:56,040
the youngsters been referred,
so there’s clearly gonna be
1420
01:05:56,040 –> 01:05:58,950
some challenges with this
test that I’m administering.
1421
01:05:58,950 –> 01:06:03,120
And, I want him to know that
it’s okay if he gets some wrong
1422
01:06:03,120 –> 01:06:07,110
and not, so for example, this
little sixth grade student
1423
01:06:07,110 –> 01:06:09,990
when things started to fall
apart and they couldn’t do it
1424
01:06:09,990 –> 01:06:13,650
says, (coughs) “these are high
school ones, aren’t they?”
1425
01:06:13,650 –> 01:06:15,960
And, I said, “they sure
are. Let’s do one more,
1426
01:06:15,960 –> 01:06:19,163
and then we have to, so we can stop.
1427
01:06:19,163 –> 01:06:21,990
The test that we use with youngsters,
1428
01:06:21,990 –> 01:06:26,430
are all nearly always upwardly
spiraling in difficulty.
1429
01:06:26,430 –> 01:06:29,250
And so, they start off with youngsters,
1430
01:06:29,250 –> 01:06:33,540
and we typically will
start off at an age level,
1431
01:06:33,540 –> 01:06:36,360
or a grade level that we
think the youngster can,
1432
01:06:36,360 –> 01:06:39,580
this is my practice, and I
hope the practice of other
1433
01:06:39,580 –> 01:06:41,520
psychologists and evaluators,
that they can be successful.
1434
01:06:41,520 –> 01:06:43,593
So, they start out, no harm, no foul,
1435
01:06:44,607 –> 01:06:46,110
they’re doing items that we believe,
1436
01:06:46,110 –> 01:06:48,240
and then they move into the other items,
1437
01:06:48,240 –> 01:06:50,384
and they get more challenging. (coughs)
1438
01:06:50,384 –> 01:06:55,013
And, because it’s standardized, it says,
1439
01:06:55,013 –> 01:06:58,232
“do not stop testing,
1440
01:06:58,232 –> 01:06:59,640
until the youngster gets
six in a row wrong.”
1441
01:06:59,640 –> 01:07:02,370
Well, the youngster knows
they’re getting them wrong,
1442
01:07:02,370 –> 01:07:05,070
and that’s, kind of, a painful situation.
1443
01:07:05,070 –> 01:07:06,810
But, when it’s tempered with the notion,
1444
01:07:06,810 –> 01:07:09,120
where they can say “those
are high school ones,”
1445
01:07:09,120 –> 01:07:10,830
it makes things feel a little better,
1446
01:07:10,830 –> 01:07:12,503
and go a little smoother, okay?
1447
01:07:14,513 –> 01:07:17,040
Exposure to the material being assessed,
1448
01:07:17,040 –> 01:07:20,790
if they’re doing something
they’ve never been done before,
1449
01:07:20,790 –> 01:07:23,880
because of perhaps limited
educational experience,
1450
01:07:23,880 –> 01:07:27,120
whatever, that’s gonna have a piece.
1451
01:07:27,120 –> 01:07:29,703
The relationship with
the evaluator is key.
1452
01:07:30,654 –> 01:07:33,420
Now, there’s sometimes
where you’re gonna have
1453
01:07:33,420 –> 01:07:36,530
contracted evaluators, and I
can only tell you what I do,
1454
01:07:36,530 –> 01:07:40,110
is I don’t do anything until I believe
1455
01:07:40,110 –> 01:07:41,670
the youngster’s comfortable.
1456
01:07:41,670 –> 01:07:45,360
So, usually I have already
interviewed the parents,
1457
01:07:45,360 –> 01:07:48,510
and I have had some
conversation with the teachers.
1458
01:07:48,510 –> 01:07:51,150
and so I have a sense
for what they’re into,
1459
01:07:51,150 –> 01:07:53,550
what they’re good at,
what’s the challenges are.
1460
01:07:54,396 –> 01:07:56,761
And, I’ll get a conversation
going about, so for example,
1461
01:07:56,761 –> 01:07:58,740
the little guy was this
week, he’s in scouts.
1462
01:07:58,740 –> 01:08:00,390
Well, I just happened to get roped.
1463
01:08:00,390 –> 01:08:01,710
Oops, did I say roped in?
1464
01:08:01,710 –> 01:08:05,430
I happened to be a newly
appointed scout leader,
1465
01:08:05,430 –> 01:08:07,680
because of, anyway, so anyway,
1466
01:08:07,680 –> 01:08:09,150
so we were able to make that connection.
1467
01:08:09,150 –> 01:08:11,790
We talked about scouting,
then he is also a skier,
1468
01:08:11,790 –> 01:08:13,950
so we talked about skiing, where we,
1469
01:08:13,950 –> 01:08:15,969
I skied the same place he skis, and bingo,
1470
01:08:15,969 –> 01:08:18,567
he was comfortable as heck,
and then we dove right in.
1471
01:08:18,567 –> 01:08:23,280
And so, (coughs) that’s really important.
1472
01:08:23,280 –> 01:08:27,600
The other thing is that I’m
famous for my treasure chest.
1473
01:08:27,600 –> 01:08:30,810
If you’re an elementary
student, I’m gonna let you know
1474
01:08:30,810 –> 01:08:32,550
that I’m expecting you to do your best.
1475
01:08:32,550 –> 01:08:34,140
And, anyone who does their best,
1476
01:08:34,140 –> 01:08:35,760
gets to pick from the treasure chest.
1477
01:08:35,760 –> 01:08:39,069
And, it has Lego kits in it, and dolls,
1478
01:08:39,069 –> 01:08:40,478
and all sorts of little things.
1479
01:08:40,478 –> 01:08:42,000
And, it provides a little
motivation on the other end,
1480
01:08:42,000 –> 01:08:44,790
for the youngsters to participate
to their highest level.
1481
01:08:44,790 –> 01:08:49,790
Okay, evaluated related
variables. (scoffs)
1482
01:08:50,460 –> 01:08:53,583
It’s a small state, but
you know, there you gotta,
1483
01:08:54,608 –> 01:08:57,810
if, you gotta be relaxed,
you gotta be calm,
1484
01:08:57,810 –> 01:09:00,974
you gotta be somewhat fun to be with.
1485
01:09:00,974 –> 01:09:04,350
If you have an evaluator
who’s kind of a stiff,
1486
01:09:04,350 –> 01:09:08,130
and when I got outta
psychology school 43 years ago,
1487
01:09:08,130 –> 01:09:12,270
I was taught the, it was
called the robotic model.
1488
01:09:12,270 –> 01:09:14,640
You couldn’t show expressions,
1489
01:09:14,640 –> 01:09:17,135
you just stick to the
book, read what it says,
1490
01:09:17,135 –> 01:09:20,795
and that doesn’t work. (coughs)
1491
01:09:20,795 –> 01:09:22,440
So, I quickly adopted the more,
you know, out there model.
1492
01:09:22,440 –> 01:09:24,870
Let’s chit chat, take
breaks, things like that.
1493
01:09:24,870 –> 01:09:29,670
And, so, you have to be
perceived as approachable,
1494
01:09:29,670 –> 01:09:33,273
and the youngster has to
be comfortable with you.
1495
01:09:34,110 –> 01:09:36,690
Lastly, but not, the environment.
1496
01:09:36,690 –> 01:09:37,740
Oh my goodness.
1497
01:09:37,740 –> 01:09:41,479
As someone who, all our schools
are really tight for space,
1498
01:09:41,479 –> 01:09:46,260
(coughs) and I’ll tell you,
one of the worst situations
1499
01:09:46,260 –> 01:09:50,190
I ever had was, I showed
up at a school to evaluate
1500
01:09:50,190 –> 01:09:52,320
a youngster who they suspected
1501
01:09:52,320 –> 01:09:54,480
had an emotional behavioral disorder.
1502
01:09:54,480 –> 01:09:56,953
And, when I got to the school,
1503
01:09:56,953 –> 01:09:58,917
they walked me through the school,
1504
01:09:58,917 –> 01:10:00,870
and then out the back door,
1505
01:10:00,870 –> 01:10:05,010
and on the parking lot there
was an abandoned trailer.
1506
01:10:05,010 –> 01:10:07,830
So, I went into the trailer
and in that trailer,
1507
01:10:07,830 –> 01:10:10,951
all sorts of things
stored all over the place.
1508
01:10:10,951 –> 01:10:12,720
(laughs) This is a true story.
1509
01:10:12,720 –> 01:10:15,750
They went, took me into the
bathroom of this trailer,
1510
01:10:15,750 –> 01:10:18,990
and in the bathroom,
everything had been taken out,
1511
01:10:18,990 –> 01:10:23,130
and there was even a hole in
the floor where the toilet was.
1512
01:10:23,130 –> 01:10:24,780
And, this is where I was gonna be.
1513
01:10:24,780 –> 01:10:28,406
And, as you might guess, I
said, “this ain’t happening.”
1514
01:10:28,406 –> 01:10:31,575
(laughs) What kinda message
you sendin’ to this kid,
1515
01:10:31,575 –> 01:10:33,801
You send him to the, so anyway.
1516
01:10:33,801 –> 01:10:38,801
That aside, the noise, you,
we have to have a quiet space.
1517
01:10:39,369 –> 01:10:42,150
Most of our buildings are made out of
1518
01:10:42,150 –> 01:10:45,390
these cinder block rooms
that they put us in.
1519
01:10:45,390 –> 01:10:48,570
Our voice reverberates all over the place.
1520
01:10:48,570 –> 01:10:50,910
So, if there’s a hearing
issue, that crops up.
1521
01:10:50,910 –> 01:10:53,120
We try to get the most (coughs) quiet,
1522
01:10:56,640 –> 01:10:58,761
and the most comfortable environment
1523
01:10:58,761 –> 01:11:01,443
in order to get things done.
1524
01:11:02,583 –> 01:11:05,250
While in this environment,
as the evaluators,
1525
01:11:05,250 –> 01:11:10,110
we need to be cognizant of
the youngster’s performance.
1526
01:11:10,110 –> 01:11:14,550
As soon as we see it to degrade,
or they’re losing interest,
1527
01:11:14,550 –> 01:11:19,440
or they’re becoming fatigued,
and we need to stop.
1528
01:11:19,440 –> 01:11:24,055
But, I once worked with a
young gal who was affected by
1529
01:11:24,055 –> 01:11:29,055
cerebral palsy and it affected her core,
1530
01:11:29,850 –> 01:11:31,950
and she was a trooper.
1531
01:11:31,950 –> 01:11:36,950
And, when she created
speech, it was exhausting,
1532
01:11:37,920 –> 01:11:40,648
and she would be breathing
heavily but just,
1533
01:11:40,648 –> 01:11:42,000
and so we would have to
take frequent breaks,
1534
01:11:42,000 –> 01:11:45,030
and we had to do it over
a number of periods.
1535
01:11:45,030 –> 01:11:48,104
And so, that’s one of
the hallmarks of these
1536
01:11:48,104 –> 01:11:50,273
cross-battery assessments
we’re gonna be talking about.
1537
01:11:51,728 –> 01:11:53,546
We have to be patient,
we have to be creative.
1538
01:11:53,546 –> 01:11:57,450
And, it might take longer
than we ordinarily would see
1539
01:11:57,450 –> 01:11:58,890
in a typical evaluation,
1540
01:11:58,890 –> 01:12:01,830
but the results we are
gonna get are worth it.
1541
01:12:01,830 –> 01:12:04,410
One of the courses I’ve
taught in the past,
1542
01:12:04,410 –> 01:12:08,250
is one is supporting children
with learning differences.
1543
01:12:08,250 –> 01:12:12,150
So, what we do is we learn
about how does ADHD affect
1544
01:12:12,150 –> 01:12:12,983
a student?
1545
01:12:12,983 –> 01:12:14,160
How does cerebral palsy affect,
1546
01:12:14,160 –> 01:12:15,810
how does an emotional disturbance affect
1547
01:12:15,810 –> 01:12:16,860
a student’s learning?
1548
01:12:18,377 –> 01:12:22,050
And, for the first three
weeks of the course,
1549
01:12:22,050 –> 01:12:23,490
this is a graduate level course,
1550
01:12:23,490 –> 01:12:25,590
we talk about relationship building,
1551
01:12:25,590 –> 01:12:27,787
and I can see people like
they’re running in place,
1552
01:12:27,787 –> 01:12:30,793
“well wait a, wait, wait, when
are we gonna start talking
1553
01:12:30,793 –> 01:12:32,850
about how do you support kids
with an emotional disturbance?
1554
01:12:32,850 –> 01:12:36,230
How do you support kids with, with ADHD.
1555
01:12:36,230 –> 01:12:40,140
So, then when we finally get to the detail
1556
01:12:40,140 –> 01:12:43,018
about supporting kids with,
say, an attention disorder,
1557
01:12:43,018 –> 01:12:45,630
when I ask the questions to the group,
1558
01:12:45,630 –> 01:12:48,762
what’s the most important
thing that you think for a kid
1559
01:12:48,762 –> 01:12:50,682
who presents this way?
1560
01:12:50,682 –> 01:12:52,810
They now say, “oh we gotta,
you gotta have a relationship
1561
01:12:52,810 –> 01:12:54,218
with these kids.”
1562
01:12:54,218 –> 01:12:55,466
And, you’re absolutely right.
1563
01:12:55,466 –> 01:12:56,778
Relationship relates.
1564
01:12:56,778 –> 01:12:58,075
So I call it the other R.
1565
01:12:58,075 –> 01:12:59,257
“Relationships” comes first,
1566
01:12:59,257 –> 01:13:00,720
and “reading,” “writing,”
and “arithmetic.”
1567
01:13:00,720 –> 01:13:03,005
So, I think it was
Valerie who said that you,
1568
01:13:03,005 –> 01:13:05,626
I couldn’t agree more, it’s
so important to, and it’s,
1569
01:13:05,626 –> 01:13:08,397
you’re gonna get much
more outta your students.
1570
01:13:08,397 –> 01:13:11,615
They’re much more willing to
work with someones. For hard.
1571
01:13:11,615 –> 01:13:15,246
Some of these students
working really hard.
1572
01:13:15,246 –> 01:13:18,944
They’re much more willing to
work really hard for someone
1573
01:13:18,944 –> 01:13:22,980
who they care about, who they
believe cares about them,
1574
01:13:22,980 –> 01:13:26,310
and then you get better results.
1575
01:13:26,310 –> 01:13:27,990
I just had a quick question, or kind of,
1576
01:13:27,990 –> 01:13:32,990
wanted to get your thoughts
on just doing, like, kind of,
1577
01:13:33,540 –> 01:13:38,540
20-minute-a-day type of
situations because, you know,
1578
01:13:38,589 –> 01:13:43,589
given the school, and having
to service other kids,
1579
01:13:44,094 –> 01:13:46,200
that’s, kind of, where
I feel like I end up.
1580
01:13:46,200 –> 01:13:48,544
I’m like, “okay, we have 20 minutes,
1581
01:13:48,544 –> 01:13:49,800
let’s kind of get as much as we can done.”
1582
01:13:49,800 –> 01:13:53,670
I know you said usually it
does take a long period of time
1583
01:13:53,670 –> 01:13:54,960
to get through stuff.
1584
01:13:54,960 –> 01:13:57,300
I mean, I feel like I
see good success from it,
1585
01:13:57,300 –> 01:13:59,662
’cause then my students don’t get burnout.
1586
01:13:59,662 –> 01:14:00,495
Yeah.
1587
01:14:00,495 –> 01:14:02,370
It’s not this, you know, two hour period
1588
01:14:02,370 –> 01:14:04,560
of asking them all these questions,
1589
01:14:04,560 –> 01:14:07,138
and then it affects the results.
1590
01:14:07,138 –> 01:14:10,980
I would agree. If, so the only caveat,
1591
01:14:10,980 –> 01:14:12,210
so 20 minutes is perfect.
1592
01:14:12,210 –> 01:14:14,790
I mean, most kids can pretend and focus,
1593
01:14:14,790 –> 01:14:16,580
and you’re gonna get your best results
1594
01:14:16,580 –> 01:14:18,510
in that 20 minute period.
1595
01:14:18,510 –> 01:14:22,350
My only caveat is that
some tests or activities
1596
01:14:22,350 –> 01:14:25,229
need to be completed
from the start to finish.
1597
01:14:25,229 –> 01:14:27,900
And so, if you’re able to
do that, so for example,
1598
01:14:27,900 –> 01:14:30,510
the Scrum tests are, so these
controlled learning tests
1599
01:14:30,510 –> 01:14:34,556
that I do with youngsters, they
take longer than 20 minutes
1600
01:14:34,556 –> 01:14:37,590
and I couldn’t stop because
it builds on itself.
1601
01:14:37,590 –> 01:14:39,690
And so, there are certain
times where I can’t do that,
1602
01:14:39,690 –> 01:14:41,290
but there are other times where,
1603
01:14:42,150 –> 01:14:43,650
in the middle of a test, depending.
1604
01:14:43,650 –> 01:14:46,330
So, if it’s a test that’s item by item,
1605
01:14:46,330 –> 01:14:48,060
that gets a little trickier.
1606
01:14:48,060 –> 01:14:50,850
I’m noticing that I’ve lost this kid,
1607
01:14:50,850 –> 01:14:53,430
he’s not with me anymore. (chuckles)
1608
01:14:53,430 –> 01:14:57,390
It’s okay to stop there,
because the subsequent items
1609
01:14:57,390 –> 01:14:59,247
don’t build on the prior items.
1610
01:14:59,247 –> 01:15:01,020
And so, that would be the only caveat.
1611
01:15:01,020 –> 01:15:03,660
But, that’s, if you can
pull off 20 minutes to get,
1612
01:15:03,660 –> 01:15:05,580
that’s to your advantage,
it fits in your schedule,
1613
01:15:05,580 –> 01:15:08,970
and it’s a student’s
advantage, because we can,
1614
01:15:08,970 –> 01:15:12,060
20 minutes is a optimal time
for youngster if they can,
1615
01:15:12,060 –> 01:15:15,090
most kids can function
(laughs) focus for 20 minutes.
1616
01:15:15,090 –> 01:15:16,963
-Yeah.
-(laughs) If that.
1617
01:15:16,963 –> 01:15:18,579
So, that just points out, Leah,
1618
01:15:18,579 –> 01:15:21,453
that all the things that we have to do,
1619
01:15:21,453 –> 01:15:26,340
and I might be biased, but
I think the assessment piece
1620
01:15:26,340 –> 01:15:27,600
is one of the most important parts,
1621
01:15:27,600 –> 01:15:29,550
because that informs everything else.
1622
01:15:29,550 –> 01:15:33,180
And so, to be squeezing
this, don’t get me wrong,
1623
01:15:33,180 –> 01:15:35,310
to be squeezing this into 20 minutes,
1624
01:15:35,310 –> 01:15:37,650
that just shows how busy you
are with all your other things,
1625
01:15:37,650 –> 01:15:40,410
and, but the fact that you’re
getting 20 quality minutes
1626
01:15:40,410 –> 01:15:42,380
a day, that’s the way to go.
1627
01:15:42,380 –> 01:15:45,379
You’re thinking about an
EBD kid, or an ADHD kid,
1628
01:15:45,379 –> 01:15:48,300
and, like, when we do Track My Progress,
1629
01:15:48,300 –> 01:15:50,487
which is done three times
a year in our school,
1630
01:15:50,487 –> 01:15:54,510
I, there is, I have an EBD kid,
1631
01:15:54,510 –> 01:15:57,030
that you would get absolutely nothing from
1632
01:15:57,030 –> 01:16:00,631
if you put him down (clears
throat) in front of that test,
1633
01:16:00,631 –> 01:16:01,464
and said, “do it.”
1634
01:16:01,464 –> 01:16:04,920
But if you, if I sit right
with him and provide,
1635
01:16:04,920 –> 01:16:06,657
like say, okay, we’re gonna do four items,
1636
01:16:06,657 –> 01:16:10,860
and I can see what he is doing
so it’s appropriate to stop,
1637
01:16:10,860 –> 01:16:12,000
and then we’ll take a break,
1638
01:16:12,000 –> 01:16:15,450
and we’ll do something that
you like, like, you know,
1639
01:16:15,450 –> 01:16:17,610
he likes to look up the
biggest snake in the world,
1640
01:16:17,610 –> 01:16:18,930
or something like that.
1641
01:16:18,930 –> 01:16:20,790
And then, we go back to the test.
1642
01:16:20,790 –> 01:16:24,810
I’m just wondering, when does
that make the test invalid?
1643
01:16:24,810 –> 01:16:26,670
Like, in those types of supports.
1644
01:16:26,670 –> 01:16:29,220
Right. I don’t think that
you’ve described anything.
1645
01:16:29,220 –> 01:16:32,040
So, it sounds like you’re, it’s a three,
1646
01:16:32,040 –> 01:16:33,870
it’s the benchmark you’re doing, mid,
1647
01:16:33,870 –> 01:16:35,607
-beginning midyear.
-[Question Asker 2] Right.
1648
01:16:35,607 –> 01:16:37,110
I didn’t hear anything that you said,
1649
01:16:37,110 –> 01:16:39,180
that invalidates that test.
1650
01:16:39,180 –> 01:16:42,780
Okay, so if I put a ruler
in where he’s reading,
1651
01:16:42,780 –> 01:16:44,940
and bring it down as he’s reading.
1652
01:16:44,940 –> 01:16:46,747
Ah, (chuckles) So that, okay.
1653
01:16:46,747 –> 01:16:51,210
So unless it tells that’s allowed,
1654
01:16:51,210 –> 01:16:53,100
So, here, you raise a great question.
1655
01:16:53,100 –> 01:16:57,030
So, depending on, so some
tests will tell you that
1656
01:16:57,030 –> 01:17:00,330
if it’s an allowed accommodation
1657
01:17:00,330 –> 01:17:04,020
that the youngster already
has for other school things,
1658
01:17:04,020 –> 01:17:06,420
they’ll allow it for their tests.
1659
01:17:06,420 –> 01:17:10,007
But, other tests will tell
you you cannot use rulers,
1660
01:17:12,690 –> 01:17:13,740
or things like that.
1661
01:17:13,740 –> 01:17:16,320
And, that’s particularly
true of time tests,
1662
01:17:16,320 –> 01:17:19,920
because they don’t want that interfering
1663
01:17:19,920 –> 01:17:22,200
with their youngster’s fluid movement,
1664
01:17:22,200 –> 01:17:24,404
done from line to line.
1665
01:17:24,404 –> 01:17:26,400
So, you would have to check
to see what they say about it.
1666
01:17:26,400 –> 01:17:29,160
But, even so, here’s the deal.
1667
01:17:29,160 –> 01:17:32,700
Even if they say that’s not
an allowed accommodation,
1668
01:17:32,700 –> 01:17:35,315
here’s your choice, you get nothing,
1669
01:17:35,315 –> 01:17:38,970
or you get something
with this accommodation.
1670
01:17:38,970 –> 01:17:43,350
So, I would error in the side
of I’m gonna get something
1671
01:17:43,350 –> 01:17:44,370
with this accommodation.
1672
01:17:44,370 –> 01:17:46,990
And then, the accommodation tells you
1673
01:17:48,756 –> 01:17:50,580
that this is an effective accommodation
1674
01:17:51,556 –> 01:17:52,523
that we might generalize
and use elsewhere.
1675
01:17:53,455 –> 01:17:54,930
And so, this is not unusual.
1676
01:17:54,930 –> 01:17:58,530
So, for example, there’s
a written expression test
1677
01:17:58,530 –> 01:18:01,281
that I will administer to youngsters,
1678
01:18:01,281 –> 01:18:04,860
and youngsters tend to do better
1679
01:18:04,860 –> 01:18:06,153
on this written expression test,
1680
01:18:06,153 –> 01:18:08,820
than they do on other
written expression tests,
1681
01:18:08,820 –> 01:18:13,153
because it, the one I administer
is a sentence starter.
1682
01:18:13,153 –> 01:18:15,870
You start the sent, and
then they have to finish it.
1683
01:18:15,870 –> 01:18:19,168
The the other one I give
is, it has word bank,
1684
01:18:19,168 –> 01:18:21,570
and they pick the words from it,
1685
01:18:21,570 –> 01:18:23,580
and then they have to write sentences.
1686
01:18:23,580 –> 01:18:27,990
So, when I write my report,
and I’ve done a record review,
1687
01:18:27,990 –> 01:18:28,920
and I’ve seen that, boy,
1688
01:18:28,920 –> 01:18:33,030
this kid does poorly on other
in-class writing assignments.
1689
01:18:33,030 –> 01:18:36,870
In my report I talk about the
fact that he was provided with
1690
01:18:36,870 –> 01:18:41,870
sentence starters, and he was
provided with a word bank.
1691
01:18:42,320 –> 01:18:45,300
And, that contributed to success.
1692
01:18:45,300 –> 01:18:48,690
This is an accommodation. Not
only would Elwood benefit,
1693
01:18:48,690 –> 01:18:50,973
but likely his and all his classmates.
1694
01:18:52,176 –> 01:18:54,330
So, let’s get word banks going,
let’s get sentence starters.
1695
01:18:54,330 –> 01:18:56,260
And, so that’s another of the,
1696
01:18:56,260 –> 01:18:58,680
that’s one of those observations,
or error analysis things
1697
01:18:58,680 –> 01:19:01,170
that we want from the
evaluators to, kind of,
1698
01:19:01,170 –> 01:19:03,240
give us hints on what we need to do.
1699
01:19:03,240 –> 01:19:06,000
And, what you’re doing is the same thing.
1700
01:19:06,000 –> 01:19:08,820
You’re seeing that, even
if it’s not allowed,
1701
01:19:08,820 –> 01:19:11,190
by you allowing to use
a paper to do the lines,
1702
01:19:11,190 –> 01:19:13,230
he’s a more proficient reader.
1703
01:19:13,230 –> 01:19:15,411
Let’s do it until he
doesn’t need to do it.
1704
01:19:15,411 –> 01:19:19,050
So, here’s where the whole idear is,
1705
01:19:19,050 –> 01:19:22,110
you’re only, and this is
by, by design and by law,
1706
01:19:22,110 –> 01:19:24,720
you’re only gonna get back what you ask.
1707
01:19:24,720 –> 01:19:27,493
If you contract me to do an evaluation,
1708
01:19:27,493 –> 01:19:30,277
and you ask specific questions,
1709
01:19:30,277 –> 01:19:33,847
I can’t sit down, when I
meet the youngster, say,
1710
01:19:33,847 –> 01:19:36,186
“well, geez, they didn’t ask about this,
1711
01:19:36,186 –> 01:19:37,633
I’m gonna look at that, or” da da.
1712
01:19:37,633 –> 01:19:41,520
This is a contract between
you, me, and the parents
1713
01:19:41,520 –> 01:19:43,050
that we have to follow.
1714
01:19:43,050 –> 01:19:46,710
And so, what goes into
that evaluation plan
1715
01:19:46,710 –> 01:19:48,511
is what you’re gonna get back.
1716
01:19:48,511 –> 01:19:53,511
And, I’m also gonna say that
if you get your report back,
1717
01:19:56,850 –> 01:20:01,850
or your results back, and the
person who has been charged
1718
01:20:02,040 –> 01:20:05,460
with doing this evaluation
hasn’t responded
1719
01:20:05,460 –> 01:20:09,337
to those questions, then
you send it back and say,
1720
01:20:09,337 –> 01:20:12,330
“wait a minute, we need these answers
1721
01:20:12,330 –> 01:20:14,310
to the specific questions you ask.”
1722
01:20:14,310 –> 01:20:16,710
And, we’re gonna talk about,
the more specific we get,
1723
01:20:16,710 –> 01:20:18,180
the more helpful it is.
1724
01:20:18,180 –> 01:20:23,180
So, for me, it’s not
unusual that I find my,
1725
01:20:23,370 –> 01:20:26,130
if I’m not a part of the
educational planning team meeting
1726
01:20:26,130 –> 01:20:29,010
and I get an emailed,
1727
01:20:29,010 –> 01:20:31,260
and there’s this evaluation plan in it.
1728
01:20:31,260 –> 01:20:32,820
More often than not,
1729
01:20:32,820 –> 01:20:35,485
I find myself calling the
special educator, and saying,
1730
01:20:35,485 –> 01:20:38,280
“I wanna review this
to be sure I understand
1731
01:20:38,280 –> 01:20:40,380
what you’re asking here,”
and bing, bing, bing,
1732
01:20:40,380 –> 01:20:42,780
and make sure I’m on the right page,
1733
01:20:42,780 –> 01:20:45,990
because I can’t go any
further than what they ask,
1734
01:20:45,990 –> 01:20:50,990
and I’m obligated to respond
to the questions they did ask.
1735
01:20:51,750 –> 01:20:53,310
that’s a, here’s a common question.
1736
01:20:53,310 –> 01:20:55,791
What’s Elwood’s current level
of cognitive ability, okay?
1737
01:20:55,791 –> 01:20:59,107
So, by asking that question,
you’re gonna get the response,
1738
01:20:59,107 –> 01:21:02,460
“well, his level of cogna ability is 85,
1739
01:21:02,460 –> 01:21:04,200
which falls within the low average range
1740
01:21:04,200 –> 01:21:06,393
of cognitive functioning.
1741
01:21:07,350 –> 01:21:08,700
Not that helpful.
1742
01:21:08,700 –> 01:21:12,720
Okay, but if we ask, “what
are the relative strengths
1743
01:21:12,720 –> 01:21:15,990
and challenges within
Elwood’s cognitive profile?”
1744
01:21:15,990 –> 01:21:18,870
So, what that requires
the evaluator to do,
1745
01:21:18,870 –> 01:21:21,600
there’s, or, and this applies
not just for cognitive,
1746
01:21:21,600 –> 01:21:23,957
but for every skill area,
is to take a look at,
1747
01:21:23,957 –> 01:21:26,670
and by what would mean
by relative strength is,
1748
01:21:26,670 –> 01:21:29,967
is some of the students that
we’re talking about here,
1749
01:21:29,967 –> 01:21:34,260
might have a profile that
everything is significantly below
1750
01:21:34,260 –> 01:21:35,880
the mean, in terms of
what we’re measuring.
1751
01:21:35,880 –> 01:21:39,900
But, some might be a bit higher,
some might be a bit lower.
1752
01:21:39,900 –> 01:21:42,150
So, the relative strength refers to that.
1753
01:21:42,150 –> 01:21:44,280
This is one of the strengths that,
1754
01:21:44,280 –> 01:21:46,680
although it might be in the
low average range still,
1755
01:21:46,680 –> 01:21:48,810
or the below average range still,
1756
01:21:48,810 –> 01:21:51,210
compared to Elwood other performance,
1757
01:21:51,210 –> 01:21:53,070
this is a relative strength,
1758
01:21:53,070 –> 01:21:55,530
that we should take
advantage of and tap into.
1759
01:21:55,530 –> 01:21:58,230
So, we want that information. Okay?
1760
01:21:58,230 –> 01:22:00,007
We wanna ask questions like,
1761
01:22:00,007 –> 01:22:02,738
“what does Elwood cognitive profile tells
1762
01:22:02,738 –> 01:22:05,488
about potential instructional
strategies and approach?”
1763
01:22:06,400 –> 01:22:08,490
So, given what we’ve learned about them,
1764
01:22:08,490 –> 01:22:10,390
are there certain things that you know
1765
01:22:11,359 –> 01:22:13,763
about providing reading
instruction, written expressions,
1766
01:22:15,057 –> 01:22:17,049
stuff like that, navigating the school,
1767
01:22:17,049 –> 01:22:19,330
that would be beneficial that you predict
1768
01:22:20,490 –> 01:22:24,330
or suppose might work for
Elwood, given his presentation.
1769
01:22:24,330 –> 01:22:26,047
Okay, another one,
1770
01:22:26,047 –> 01:22:29,190
“what is Elwood’s current
level of adaptive behavior?”
1771
01:22:29,190 –> 01:22:31,758
If it’s a youngster who we suspect
1772
01:22:31,758 –> 01:22:32,850
has an intellectual disability,
1773
01:22:32,850 –> 01:22:35,210
we have to ask that question,
1774
01:22:35,210 –> 01:22:36,450
as part of the eligibility piece.
1775
01:22:36,450 –> 01:22:38,200
But, we need to go further and say,
1776
01:22:40,303 –> 01:22:41,400
“okay, relative strengths and
challenges within adaptive,
1777
01:22:41,400 –> 01:22:42,660
what are they?
1778
01:22:42,660 –> 01:22:45,030
What does he tend to be better at?
1779
01:22:45,030 –> 01:22:46,140
We have some kids who,
1780
01:22:46,140 –> 01:22:48,600
some young people who might
be on the social domain,
1781
01:22:48,600 –> 01:22:51,360
might be very strong, but on the academic
1782
01:22:51,360 –> 01:22:53,253
and self-care domain might be low.
1783
01:22:54,510 –> 01:22:56,220
And then, we might also wanna ask,
1784
01:22:56,220 –> 01:22:58,506
I don’t have it here, we
might wanna ask the question,
1785
01:22:58,506 –> 01:23:02,340
“given Elwood’s adaptive behavior profile,
1786
01:23:02,340 –> 01:23:04,120
what recommendations would be made
1787
01:23:04,969 –> 01:23:08,535
for targeting skill development?
1788
01:23:08,535 –> 01:23:10,620
What might come next?
1789
01:23:10,620 –> 01:23:13,140
Do you have recommendations for the team?
1790
01:23:13,140 –> 01:23:15,093
What can he do? What can’t he do?
1791
01:23:16,178 –> 01:23:18,063
What do you think might be
the next place to start,
1792
01:23:18,063 –> 01:23:21,570
whatever, in terms of
building and improving
1793
01:23:21,570 –> 01:23:24,390
his overall adaptive
behavior, in this case?
1794
01:23:24,390 –> 01:23:26,430
All right, here comes,
if you’re a quantoid,
1795
01:23:26,430 –> 01:23:27,570
you’re in for a ride.
1796
01:23:27,570 –> 01:23:29,013
This is, I love this stuff.
1797
01:23:30,023 –> 01:23:33,660
So, but I’m gonna be gentle,
but there are some statistics
1798
01:23:33,660 –> 01:23:35,790
and psychometric things
that we need to understand,
1799
01:23:35,790 –> 01:23:37,864
so we can advocate for our students.
1800
01:23:37,864 –> 01:23:41,310
And, so we can also have a (clears throat)
1801
01:23:41,310 –> 01:23:45,300
we can inform the tests that
we use when we start looking
1802
01:23:45,300 –> 01:23:47,700
at this cross-battery piece, whereby,
1803
01:23:47,700 –> 01:23:51,975
we’re matching tests to
the students that are,
1804
01:23:51,975 –> 01:23:54,330
were our central focus.
1805
01:23:54,330 –> 01:23:57,127
So, reliability just refers to,
1806
01:23:57,127 –> 01:24:00,183
“Hey, can I, are these, can I
be confident in these results?
1807
01:24:00,183 –> 01:24:05,183
Are they consistent? And,
can I hang my hat at,
1808
01:24:05,460 –> 01:24:08,130
can I feel comfortable going
to a meeting saying this?”
1809
01:24:08,130 –> 01:24:10,080
This score actually represents the skill
1810
01:24:10,080 –> 01:24:11,340
that it’s measuring.
1811
01:24:11,340 –> 01:24:14,040
So, just as a, kind of, a benchmark,
1812
01:24:14,040 –> 01:24:19,040
if you’re making a life altering
or an important decision
1813
01:24:20,970 –> 01:24:22,807
about a youngster, and
you’re using test data,
1814
01:24:22,807 –> 01:24:26,390
that test data has to
have a reliability of 0.9
1815
01:24:26,390 –> 01:24:28,860
or above, okay?
1816
01:24:28,860 –> 01:24:33,860
And, you can ask your
evaluators, or you can to be sure
1817
01:24:33,930 –> 01:24:36,360
that they use tools
that meet that standard,
1818
01:24:36,360 –> 01:24:38,790
also yourselves, look at your materials,
1819
01:24:38,790 –> 01:24:42,840
check in the manuals, check
to see if the reliabilities.
1820
01:24:42,840 –> 01:24:44,310
One things you’ll notice is,
1821
01:24:44,310 –> 01:24:46,470
the reliability sometimes change with age.
1822
01:24:46,470 –> 01:24:49,650
So, you might have a youngster
who is eight years old,
1823
01:24:49,650 –> 01:24:50,953
and a certain test,
1824
01:24:50,953 –> 01:24:52,080
“(imitates grimace) it’s not reliable,
1825
01:24:52,080 –> 01:24:53,130
it’s not that great.”
1826
01:24:54,172 –> 01:24:55,340
But, then at 12 year old,
1827
01:24:55,340 –> 01:24:56,220
it tends to become a little more reliable.
1828
01:24:56,220 –> 01:24:57,570
So, it takes,
1829
01:24:57,570 –> 01:25:00,780
this is gonna be what’s
part of the new world order
1830
01:25:00,780 –> 01:25:05,610
for assessment, in terms
of applying good practices
1831
01:25:05,610 –> 01:25:08,160
to children experience and
low incident disabilities,
1832
01:25:08,160 –> 01:25:10,590
in addition to all the other assessments
1833
01:25:10,590 –> 01:25:13,620
we’re gonna be doing
under a responsiveness
1834
01:25:13,620 –> 01:25:14,670
to intervention model,
1835
01:25:14,670 –> 01:25:19,670
or a patterns of strength
and weakness model.
1836
01:25:20,347 –> 01:25:22,332
Just wanna mention something,
1837
01:25:22,332 –> 01:25:25,407
I, other people refer to it as MTSS,
1838
01:25:25,407 –> 01:25:28,613
and that’s the term that
the state has adopted it.
1839
01:25:28,613 –> 01:25:33,600
I’m sticking with the RTI
model, because a tiered system
1840
01:25:33,600 –> 01:25:36,960
of approach is one part of the RTI model.
1841
01:25:36,960 –> 01:25:40,741
And, but there are so many other
parts that are so important
1842
01:25:40,741 –> 01:25:42,960
for this model to be successful,
1843
01:25:42,960 –> 01:25:45,960
that they have to be attended to.
1844
01:25:45,960 –> 01:25:48,510
Things like screening,
and progress monitoring,
1845
01:25:48,510 –> 01:25:49,920
and stuff like that.
1846
01:25:49,920 –> 01:25:53,610
And, so anyway, I stick with
the RTI, rather than the MTSS.
1847
01:25:53,610 –> 01:25:55,890
Just so you know, we’re
talking about a similar thing,
1848
01:25:55,890 –> 01:25:59,010
but when I talk about RTI, it’s
more comprehensive approach.
1849
01:25:59,010 –> 01:26:03,450
Okay, so one of the things to
think about, this reliability,
1850
01:26:03,450 –> 01:26:07,470
oh, so secondly, so if
you’re gonna use data
1851
01:26:07,470 –> 01:26:10,770
from a variety of sources
to contribute to a decision,
1852
01:26:10,770 –> 01:26:14,523
then that data can have a
reliability of 0.8 or above.
1853
01:26:16,110 –> 01:26:19,020
And so, if you’re having
multiple data points
1854
01:26:19,020 –> 01:26:20,725
to help you decide,
1855
01:26:20,725 –> 01:26:22,025
“yeah, this is a strength,
1856
01:26:22,917 –> 01:26:24,870
or this is a significant
challenge, (clears throat)
1857
01:26:24,870 –> 01:26:26,640
it’s a direction we should
go, in terms of programming,”
1858
01:26:26,640 –> 01:26:29,910
then multiple data points
at a lower reliability,
1859
01:26:29,910 –> 01:26:31,170
is acceptable.
1860
01:26:31,170 –> 01:26:32,280
I want you to think about something.
1861
01:26:32,280 –> 01:26:35,013
There are some tests out there
have that have liabilities.
1862
01:26:35,013 –> 01:26:36,870
There are fewer and farer between,
1863
01:26:36,870 –> 01:26:39,990
because we’ve become
better informed consumers,
1864
01:26:39,990 –> 01:26:41,920
and test developers are getting better
1865
01:26:42,845 –> 01:26:44,693
at their test development.
1866
01:26:44,693 –> 01:26:46,485
But, there are some tests out there
1867
01:26:46,485 –> 01:26:47,783
that have a reliability of 0.7.
1868
01:26:49,372 –> 01:26:50,700
And, so whenever you
square the reliability,
1869
01:26:50,700 –> 01:26:52,590
it’s called the reliability coefficient,
1870
01:26:52,590 –> 01:26:56,580
whenever you square that,
that tells you how much
1871
01:26:56,580 –> 01:26:59,400
of your score that you’re seeing, is,
1872
01:26:59,400 –> 01:27:01,920
represents the actual
skill you’re measuring,
1873
01:27:01,920 –> 01:27:04,140
and how much represents error.
1874
01:27:04,140 –> 01:27:08,640
So, think about this, if you square 0.7,
1875
01:27:08,640 –> 01:27:11,370
which is the reliability
of a particular math test
1876
01:27:11,370 –> 01:27:14,940
you might be using, that’s 49.
1877
01:27:14,940 –> 01:27:19,940
So, that means that 49% of
the score you just received
1878
01:27:20,430 –> 01:27:24,955
is reflective of his math ability
and 51% is something else.
1879
01:27:24,955 –> 01:27:28,020
So, you may as well flip a coin.
1880
01:27:28,020 –> 01:27:32,479
So, we should never be using
any tests that are below 8,
1881
01:27:32,479 –> 01:27:35,640
in terms of the reliability,
1882
01:27:35,640 –> 01:27:37,380
because anything lower than that,
1883
01:27:37,380 –> 01:27:39,582
they don’t provide us with information
1884
01:27:39,582 –> 01:27:41,454
that is any use to us, okay?
1885
01:27:41,454 –> 01:27:43,537
Validity refers to,
1886
01:27:43,537 –> 01:27:46,989
“does this test really measure
what it says to measure?”
1887
01:27:46,989 –> 01:27:50,070
I think a great example
of this being a problem
1888
01:27:50,070 –> 01:27:52,830
was there was a test out there
1889
01:27:52,830 –> 01:27:55,710
that was one of the most popular
tests used in the country,
1890
01:27:55,710 –> 01:27:58,647
and it had a test on it,
was a cognitive test,
1891
01:27:58,647 –> 01:28:00,990
and it had a test called “Arithmetic.”
1892
01:28:00,990 –> 01:28:04,410
Well, number one, my problem
is why would you have
1893
01:28:04,410 –> 01:28:06,720
an arithmetic test on a cognitive test,
1894
01:28:06,720 –> 01:28:09,660
because arithmetic test is
something that you learn
1895
01:28:09,660 –> 01:28:11,577
in schools, arithmetic skills.
1896
01:28:11,577 –> 01:28:13,620
And so, that should be
in an achievement test.
1897
01:28:13,620 –> 01:28:16,920
So, having a skill, or
a school-based test,
1898
01:28:16,920 –> 01:28:20,280
in a cognitive assessment,
throws things off.
1899
01:28:20,280 –> 01:28:23,670
So, most, all cognitive
assessments should only be,
1900
01:28:23,670 –> 01:28:26,880
those should only have tasks on those
1901
01:28:26,880 –> 01:28:28,440
that we have not been exposed to,
1902
01:28:28,440 –> 01:28:30,718
or that we don’t teach in school.
1903
01:28:30,718 –> 01:28:35,640
So, secondly though, with
what we finally discovered,
1904
01:28:35,640 –> 01:28:39,573
was that with the advent of
a new computer technologies,
1905
01:28:39,573 –> 01:28:42,300
and this test had been around for years,
1906
01:28:42,300 –> 01:28:44,310
when they did a thing
called “factor analysis”,
1907
01:28:44,310 –> 01:28:45,610
and I won’t bore you with that,
1908
01:28:45,610 –> 01:28:48,000
well, they found out this arithmetic test
1909
01:28:48,000 –> 01:28:49,800
was not measuring arithmetic,
1910
01:28:49,800 –> 01:28:53,100
it was measuring short-term memory,
1911
01:28:53,100 –> 01:28:55,440
because the way it was
set up was that you would,
1912
01:28:55,440 –> 01:28:57,600
as the administrator,
would give the youngster
1913
01:28:57,600 –> 01:29:01,084
a word problem and they had to respond.
1914
01:29:01,084 –> 01:29:03,450
And, what happened was that if you had
1915
01:29:03,450 –> 01:29:07,110
short-term memory deficits,
you did poorly on this test.
1916
01:29:07,110 –> 01:29:09,530
If you had strong short-term memory,
1917
01:29:09,530 –> 01:29:13,320
you did well on this
test, and your math skills
1918
01:29:13,320 –> 01:29:15,840
had nothing to do with your
performance on this test.
1919
01:29:15,840 –> 01:29:20,100
So, that was an invalid test.
It was named arithmetic,
1920
01:29:20,100 –> 01:29:22,300
but it wasn’t measuring that at all, okay?
1921
01:29:22,300 –> 01:29:26,190
Standard deviation,
we’re gonna talk about.
1922
01:29:26,190 –> 01:29:27,787
We talked about that a bit already.
1923
01:29:27,787 –> 01:29:31,210
It defines the average range, and so,
1924
01:29:31,210 –> 01:29:34,950
it’s one standard deviation
above the mean, one below.
1925
01:29:34,950 –> 01:29:37,980
So, it’s usually, for all the
tests that you’ll be using,
1926
01:29:37,980 –> 01:29:39,675
it’s gonna be 15 points.
1927
01:29:39,675 –> 01:29:42,600
Psychologists use ones
that I said earlier,
1928
01:29:42,600 –> 01:29:44,250
are at 10 points,
1929
01:29:44,250 –> 01:29:46,476
but for the ones that you’re
gonna be using are 15.
1930
01:29:46,476 –> 01:29:49,730
Every time you move a standard deviation,
1931
01:29:49,730 –> 01:29:51,390
in one direction or another,
1932
01:29:51,390 –> 01:29:53,793
you’ve either jumped over a lot of people,
1933
01:29:55,737 –> 01:29:57,720
and that represents, I tell
kids, “that’s your superpower.
1934
01:29:57,720 –> 01:29:59,880
You’ve jumped over a lot of people.”
1935
01:29:59,880 –> 01:30:01,620
When you go in the other direction,
1936
01:30:01,620 –> 01:30:04,080
that’s the youngster’s
kryptonite, that when you,
1937
01:30:04,080 –> 01:30:07,010
every time you go 50, a standard
deviation below the mean,
1938
01:30:07,010 –> 01:30:12,010
your skill defecate begrows
more significant, okay?
1939
01:30:12,027 –> 01:30:13,950
So, it’s a measure of relative standing.
1940
01:30:13,950 –> 01:30:17,130
Where were you compared to
everyone in the norm-sample?
1941
01:30:17,130 –> 01:30:19,392
Standard error measurement. We’re gonna,
1942
01:30:19,392 –> 01:30:21,210
this is very important, particularly for,
1943
01:30:21,210 –> 01:30:24,870
I’ve seen this at the high
school-level, become a problem,
1944
01:30:24,870 –> 01:30:28,590
when we are transitioning
young adults to adult services.
1945
01:30:28,590 –> 01:30:31,050
And, I’m gonna give it a example
1946
01:30:31,050 –> 01:30:32,880
of where this becomes a problem.
1947
01:30:32,880 –> 01:30:37,058
But, what standard error
measurement is, (coughs)
1948
01:30:37,058 –> 01:30:41,610
it’s the error associated
with a single score.
1949
01:30:41,610 –> 01:30:45,780
And, a good test, a well-developed test,
1950
01:30:45,780 –> 01:30:48,450
will tell you what the
standard error measurement is
1951
01:30:48,450 –> 01:30:51,426
for every test that’s
within that test battery.
1952
01:30:51,426 –> 01:30:56,280
And, generally, it tends to be
around three, but it varies.
1953
01:30:56,280 –> 01:30:58,980
And so, we’re gonna see in a minute,
1954
01:30:58,980 –> 01:31:01,830
why all this is important. (clears throat)
1955
01:31:01,830 –> 01:31:04,323
In terms of reporting out results,
1956
01:31:05,775 –> 01:31:07,530
remember sharing results in a
report fashion with parents?
1957
01:31:07,530 –> 01:31:11,100
The state and federal
regulations say that we need
1958
01:31:11,100 –> 01:31:13,200
to consider the standard
error of measurement
1959
01:31:13,200 –> 01:31:15,120
when reporting scores.
1960
01:31:15,120 –> 01:31:18,480
And, the reason for that,
is to communicate to parents
1961
01:31:18,480 –> 01:31:23,160
that this is not Sacco
timing from the Olympics.
1962
01:31:23,160 –> 01:31:24,780
All these assessment things we’re doing
1963
01:31:24,780 –> 01:31:26,940
have error associated with them.
1964
01:31:26,940 –> 01:31:29,640
And so, we’re gonna see
that there’s, kind of,
1965
01:31:29,640 –> 01:31:31,833
a band or an area in which,
1966
01:31:32,711 –> 01:31:34,740
we believe your son or
daughter is functioning.
1967
01:31:34,740 –> 01:31:37,020
And, that’s what we’re gonna address.
1968
01:31:37,020 –> 01:31:40,910
And, I’m going to show you
how we need to say that
1969
01:31:40,910 –> 01:31:43,320
to parents, as well as
how we need to write it
1970
01:31:43,320 –> 01:31:44,790
in our reports.
1971
01:31:44,790 –> 01:31:48,450
And, then lastly, as part of
the psychometrics, please,
1972
01:31:48,450 –> 01:31:50,760
we’re gonna look at the
various kinds of scores,
1973
01:31:50,760 –> 01:31:53,790
what they mean, and who we
should be using them with,
1974
01:31:53,790 –> 01:31:55,410
and when we should be using.
1975
01:31:55,410 –> 01:31:57,600
And, on the other side, when
we should be avoiding them.
1976
01:31:57,600 –> 01:31:58,503
Okay? Okay.
1977
01:31:59,520 –> 01:32:01,200
So, in terms of reliability,
1978
01:32:01,200 –> 01:32:03,344
I just wanna let you
know they’re out there,
1979
01:32:03,344 –> 01:32:05,070
and at least feel comfortable.
1980
01:32:05,070 –> 01:32:06,512
Yep.
1981
01:32:06,512 –> 01:32:11,373
Did I just heard something? Did? No com?
1982
01:32:11,373 –> 01:32:12,946
Am I still with us?
1983
01:32:12,946 –> 01:32:15,150
Yep. You’re you’re still there,
1984
01:32:15,150 –> 01:32:16,500
I’m not sure what that was.
1985
01:32:17,461 –> 01:32:19,110
So, this is kind of in the weeds,
1986
01:32:19,110 –> 01:32:20,580
this is kind of in the weeds,
1987
01:32:20,580 –> 01:32:22,725
but just to let you know the aware of ’em,
1988
01:32:22,725 –> 01:32:26,820
and we need to feel comfortable asking
1989
01:32:26,820 –> 01:32:30,810
our contracted evaluators, and
also feel comfortable getting
1990
01:32:30,810 –> 01:32:32,467
into the manuals ourselves, to see,
1991
01:32:32,467 –> 01:32:34,680
“okay, what is the
reliability of this stuff
1992
01:32:34,680 –> 01:32:36,880
that I’ve been using
or that I plan to use?”
1993
01:32:38,130 –> 01:32:40,710
So, the kinds of reliability
you’re gonna see is
1994
01:32:40,710 –> 01:32:41,730
test/retest.
1995
01:32:41,730 –> 01:32:43,170
That’s the best kind.
1996
01:32:43,170 –> 01:32:47,910
And, what’s happened there is
you’ve administered the test
1997
01:32:47,910 –> 01:32:52,110
to someone, and then you come
back within a week or so,
1998
01:32:52,110 –> 01:32:53,490
and re-administer it.
1999
01:32:53,490 –> 01:32:55,203
And, absent practice effects,
2000
01:32:56,229 –> 01:32:58,920
those two scores should
be be fairly similar,
2001
01:32:58,920 –> 01:33:00,153
as you might guess.
2002
01:33:01,339 –> 01:33:02,693
That’s the most expensive way,
2003
01:33:03,715 –> 01:33:05,592
because when a test is being normed,
2004
01:33:05,592 –> 01:33:08,430
they’re paying people like me
and you to do this testing,
2005
01:33:08,430 –> 01:33:10,770
and now I’ve gotta go back
and do it a second time.
2006
01:33:10,770 –> 01:33:13,127
Well, you gotta pay me a second.
2007
01:33:13,127 –> 01:33:15,831
I mean, also, we also pay,
our test subjects get paid,
2008
01:33:15,831 –> 01:33:16,920
as well.
2009
01:33:16,920 –> 01:33:19,980
I have two grandchildren who
have a college fund set up,
2010
01:33:19,980 –> 01:33:22,530
I’ve tested them so many
times, it’s part of norming.
2011
01:33:22,530 –> 01:33:26,610
But anyway, so test-retest,
that’s the gold standard.
2012
01:33:27,976 –> 01:33:30,480
There’s a good chance,
depending on the test,
2013
01:33:30,480 –> 01:33:32,220
that it won’t even be
listed in the manual,
2014
01:33:32,220 –> 01:33:34,260
because it’s expensive to,
2015
01:33:34,260 –> 01:33:37,740
so there are certain test
publishers who produce,
2016
01:33:37,740 –> 01:33:39,527
what I call, quick and dirty tests,
2017
01:33:39,527 –> 01:33:42,234
and you’re not likely to have that, okay,
2018
01:33:42,234 –> 01:33:45,369
test-retest piece, because of the expense.
2019
01:33:45,369 –> 01:33:48,433
Alternate form means that, so for example,
2020
01:33:48,433 –> 01:33:51,521
those of you who are familiar
with Woodcock Johnson,
2021
01:33:51,521 –> 01:33:56,190
and also the Wechsler
Individual Achievement test,
2022
01:33:56,190 –> 01:33:58,500
there’s a form A, and there’s a form B.
2023
01:33:58,500 –> 01:34:01,700
The items on the test are comparable,
2024
01:34:03,840 –> 01:34:05,730
they’re not the same,
but they’re comparable.
2025
01:34:05,730 –> 01:34:09,750
And so, what they do is, they
administer the test form A,
2026
01:34:09,750 –> 01:34:12,630
to an individual, and then they do form B,
2027
01:34:12,630 –> 01:34:15,060
and they make sure that the two forms
2028
01:34:15,060 –> 01:34:16,830
that come up with similar results.
2029
01:34:16,830 –> 01:34:19,768
And, that’s alternate form reliability.
2030
01:34:19,768 –> 01:34:23,770
So, one of the values is we
talked about validity of a test
2031
01:34:24,758 –> 01:34:26,578
and some of the rooms
we find ourselves in,
2032
01:34:26,578 –> 01:34:29,670
whenever I’m conducting an eval,
2033
01:34:29,670 –> 01:34:32,691
I talk with the most important
person in the building
2034
01:34:32,691 –> 01:34:36,390
before I start, and that’s
the school secretary,
2035
01:34:36,390 –> 01:34:38,670
or now, administrative assistant.
2036
01:34:38,670 –> 01:34:42,360
And I say, “any drills going
on today, any fire drills,
2037
01:34:42,360 –> 01:34:43,650
any active shooter drills?”
2038
01:34:43,650 –> 01:34:45,930
I mean, there were so
many drills we’re doing.
2039
01:34:45,930 –> 01:34:48,810
And, if the answer is “yes,”
I find out when that is,
2040
01:34:48,810 –> 01:34:51,990
because I do not want my
testing session interrupted
2041
01:34:51,990 –> 01:34:55,320
by what, that’s gonna
invalidate some of the tests,
2042
01:34:55,320 –> 01:34:57,010
if I’m in the middle of a test.
2043
01:34:57,010 –> 01:35:00,600
In the event that
happens, and I’m not sure,
2044
01:35:00,600 –> 01:35:02,994
when I have a test that
has alternate forms,
2045
01:35:02,994 –> 01:35:05,683
one of the beauties is, I can grab that.
2046
01:35:05,683 –> 01:35:08,970
Suppose I was administering
one of the controlled learning
2047
01:35:08,970 –> 01:35:12,960
tests where, and it got blown,
I can, and I’m using form A,
2048
01:35:12,960 –> 01:35:14,400
I can grab the one out of form B,
2049
01:35:14,400 –> 01:35:17,520
and still have reliable and valid results.
2050
01:35:17,520 –> 01:35:19,650
Okay, internal consistency,
2051
01:35:19,650 –> 01:35:21,840
this is the one you’re gonna see the most.
2052
01:35:21,840 –> 01:35:25,440
And, this is the one where
test developers are cheaters,
2053
01:35:25,440 –> 01:35:26,280
and dishonest.
2054
01:35:26,280 –> 01:35:28,541
There’s no other way to put it.
2055
01:35:28,541 –> 01:35:32,430
So, what they do is,
they’ll take the test,
2056
01:35:32,430 –> 01:35:35,197
and suppose it’s a hundred item math test,
2057
01:35:35,197 –> 01:35:37,770
they split it in half, odd numbers.
2058
01:35:37,770 –> 01:35:41,490
So, they administer all the
test items to a group of people
2059
01:35:41,490 –> 01:35:45,690
and then they split it in half,
odd items versus even items.
2060
01:35:45,690 –> 01:35:47,250
And, then they compare the results
2061
01:35:47,250 –> 01:35:48,900
to see if they’re the same,
2062
01:35:48,900 –> 01:35:50,650
that they do a correlational study.
2063
01:35:51,630 –> 01:35:54,300
But, the way they tweak this,
and they cheat, is that,
2064
01:35:54,300 –> 01:35:57,690
suppose I’m taking this
test, and I noticed that,
2065
01:35:57,690 –> 01:36:00,630
I’m one of the test developers
and the statisticians,
2066
01:36:00,630 –> 01:36:05,630
and I noticed that test item
two, I’m sorry, number four,
2067
01:36:07,500 –> 01:36:11,043
the students always get right
if they got number two right.
2068
01:36:12,660 –> 01:36:17,660
So, what I might do, is
move four to number three.
2069
01:36:18,480 –> 01:36:20,850
So, now it ends up in the other test,
2070
01:36:20,850 –> 01:36:22,080
if you know what I mean.
2071
01:36:22,080 –> 01:36:23,910
And, if we’re both getting them right,
2072
01:36:23,910 –> 01:36:24,990
that’s going to increase.
2073
01:36:24,990 –> 01:36:26,430
I know this is in the weeds,
2074
01:36:26,430 –> 01:36:30,210
but that’s going to
increase my reliability.
2075
01:36:30,210 –> 01:36:32,820
And so, I’m manipulating the test items.
2076
01:36:32,820 –> 01:36:36,870
And so, and that’s not beyond
what test developers will do.
2077
01:36:36,870 –> 01:36:38,370
So, they manipulate the test items,
2078
01:36:38,370 –> 01:36:41,280
so that there’s a high probability
2079
01:36:41,280 –> 01:36:44,730
that you’re gonna get
a higher correlation,
2080
01:36:44,730 –> 01:36:48,176
or positive relationship
between (coughs) the two parts.
2081
01:36:48,176 –> 01:36:52,080
That’s done electronically,
by computer program.
2082
01:36:52,080 –> 01:36:53,190
Costs nothing.
2083
01:36:53,190 –> 01:36:55,656
So, that’s the one you’re always gonna see
2084
01:36:55,656 –> 01:36:59,910
when you go into the manuals
and look for reliability.
2085
01:36:59,910 –> 01:37:03,420
You will always get internal consistency,
2086
01:37:03,420 –> 01:37:05,820
and perhaps nothing else.
2087
01:37:05,820 –> 01:37:09,066
And then, lastly, inter-rater
or inter-scorer reliability.
2088
01:37:09,066 –> 01:37:12,480
If the more complicated a test is,
2089
01:37:12,480 –> 01:37:14,282
the more challenging it is.
2090
01:37:14,282 –> 01:37:16,740
So, as I mentioned earlier,
2091
01:37:16,740 –> 01:37:20,100
I have a relationship
with Riverside Publishing.
2092
01:37:20,100 –> 01:37:22,020
On the upside, everything
that they publish
2093
01:37:22,020 –> 01:37:23,910
is really high quality.
2094
01:37:23,910 –> 01:37:27,466
On the downside, much of
it is very complicated
2095
01:37:27,466 –> 01:37:28,983
to administer,
2096
01:37:29,924 –> 01:37:31,230
which I’ll let the cat out.
2097
01:37:31,230 –> 01:37:33,240
The fifth version of all these tests
2098
01:37:33,240 –> 01:37:35,250
is gonna eliminate some
of that complications,
2099
01:37:35,250 –> 01:37:39,900
but, which can result
in inter-rater problems,
2100
01:37:39,900 –> 01:37:42,180
that I might score something wrong,
2101
01:37:42,180 –> 01:37:44,310
or I might administer
the testing correctly,
2102
01:37:44,310 –> 01:37:45,610
and get different results.
2103
01:37:47,298 –> 01:37:48,131
And so, any of you folks,
2104
01:37:49,057 –> 01:37:50,310
I know that there’s at
least one person out there
2105
01:37:51,415 –> 01:37:53,640
on the line today, who did
some assessment work with me.
2106
01:37:53,640 –> 01:37:57,240
And, we spent a lot of time
on some of these tricky tests
2107
01:37:57,240 –> 01:38:00,030
at practicing the administration,
so we would get it right.
2108
01:38:00,030 –> 01:38:02,280
So, we wanna reduce,
remember what we said,
2109
01:38:02,280 –> 01:38:05,310
what’s the greatest source of error
2110
01:38:05,310 –> 01:38:07,839
or unreliability in assessment?
2111
01:38:07,839 –> 01:38:08,894
It’s you and me.
2112
01:38:08,894 –> 01:38:10,126
So, we need to,
2113
01:38:10,126 –> 01:38:12,335
if we’re using these tests
that are a little complicated,
2114
01:38:12,335 –> 01:38:13,500
we need to be sure that we’re fluent
2115
01:38:13,500 –> 01:38:16,440
in the administration of them.
2116
01:38:16,440 –> 01:38:18,047
Okay?
2117
01:38:18,047 –> 01:38:19,422
So again, I reiterate,
2118
01:38:19,422 –> 01:38:21,693
for big decisions about our students, 0.9.
2119
01:38:23,827 –> 01:38:27,510
If the data’s gonna go into
with other pieces of data
2120
01:38:27,510 –> 01:38:29,550
to make a decision, 0.8.
2121
01:38:29,550 –> 01:38:31,620
And, typically stay away from anything
2122
01:38:31,620 –> 01:38:33,363
that’s slower than 0.8.
2123
01:38:35,370 –> 01:38:37,458
All right, “Validity,”
2124
01:38:37,458 –> 01:38:40,080
I’m not gonna spend a lot of time on this,
2125
01:38:40,080 –> 01:38:42,420
but I just wanted to
mention that it’s out there.
2126
01:38:42,420 –> 01:38:44,430
Face validity. Does it look
like what it’s measuring?
2127
01:38:44,430 –> 01:38:46,500
If you got a math test, it’s
got math problems on it.
2128
01:38:46,500 –> 01:38:51,500
Okay, content. Does it
contain all the important,
2129
01:38:52,890 –> 01:38:55,170
so this is, kind of, an
important for test selection,
2130
01:38:55,170 –> 01:38:58,800
does it contain all the
important aspects of the math?
2131
01:38:58,800 –> 01:39:00,300
So, for example, does it start off
2132
01:39:00,300 –> 01:39:02,190
with letter identification,
2133
01:39:02,190 –> 01:39:05,910
I mean number identification,
then go to sequencing,
2134
01:39:05,910 –> 01:39:08,970
and then go to additions,
subtracting, for example,
2135
01:39:08,970 –> 01:39:11,152
have all the content
that you’re looking for?
2136
01:39:11,152 –> 01:39:13,327
Concurrent validity refers to,
2137
01:39:13,327 –> 01:39:15,930
“okay, if I administer this math test,
2138
01:39:15,930 –> 01:39:17,640
if I administer the KeyMath,
2139
01:39:17,640 –> 01:39:20,430
and then I administer the
Woodcock Johnson Cognitive,
2140
01:39:20,430 –> 01:39:22,467
I mean a Calculation test,
2141
01:39:22,467 –> 01:39:24,540
are those scores gonna be similar?”
2142
01:39:24,540 –> 01:39:29,540
So, if I have a good test,
that is reliable and valid,
2143
01:39:29,970 –> 01:39:33,150
is another test that I’m
choosing gonna match that?
2144
01:39:33,150 –> 01:39:34,500
Which would suggest, and if it did,
2145
01:39:34,500 –> 01:39:37,078
it’d suggest that test is
reliable and valid too.
2146
01:39:37,078 –> 01:39:42,078
Predictive validity. Does
the test predict behavior?
2147
01:39:42,660 –> 01:39:46,053
This is what the whole
discrepancy model is based on,
2148
01:39:46,053 –> 01:39:50,430
is does your cognitive score
predict your achievement score?
2149
01:39:50,430 –> 01:39:54,150
We’ve been believing
that for over 50 years.
2150
01:39:54,150 –> 01:39:56,687
We’re moving away from that now.
2151
01:39:56,687 –> 01:40:00,813
And so, just as, kind of,
2152
01:40:01,839 –> 01:40:03,960
a thought about why we’re moving away,
2153
01:40:03,960 –> 01:40:08,040
your cognitive abilities only predict 50%
2154
01:40:08,040 –> 01:40:10,320
of your academic achievement.
2155
01:40:10,320 –> 01:40:11,670
And, if we, if this was a group,
2156
01:40:11,670 –> 01:40:13,357
I’d ask you to start
yelling out right now,
2157
01:40:13,357 –> 01:40:15,360
“well, what’s the other 50%?”
2158
01:40:15,360 –> 01:40:18,624
And, but I’m gonna tell you
instead, it’s you, our teachers,
2159
01:40:18,624 –> 01:40:22,140
our parents, our environment, our peers,
2160
01:40:22,140 –> 01:40:25,290
all these other things
go into the other 50%
2161
01:40:25,290 –> 01:40:29,640
that results in our being
successful in the academic arena
2162
01:40:29,640 –> 01:40:32,190
or unsuccessful in the academic arena.
2163
01:40:32,190 –> 01:40:34,500
And, our cognitive abilities only account
2164
01:40:34,500 –> 01:40:36,060
for half of that success,
2165
01:40:36,060 –> 01:40:37,950
which is one of the reasons
why we’re moving away
2166
01:40:37,950 –> 01:40:40,680
from the discrepancy model.
2167
01:40:40,680 –> 01:40:43,500
And, “construct validity”
isn’t measuring something
2168
01:40:43,500 –> 01:40:46,827
that it’s supposed to measure
so, and not something else.
2169
01:40:46,827 –> 01:40:48,859
So, that’s what the example I gave you
2170
01:40:48,859 –> 01:40:50,550
with that arithmetic test that we found
2171
01:40:50,550 –> 01:40:52,080
was not measuring arithmetic test,
2172
01:40:52,080 –> 01:40:54,870
but instead was measuring
short-term memory.
2173
01:40:54,870 –> 01:40:58,970
So, in terms of validity, the
take home message for this
2174
01:40:58,970 –> 01:41:03,970
is that it’s the fact that
the predictive validity
2175
01:41:04,080 –> 01:41:06,780
of Cognitive’s tests is so low,
2176
01:41:06,780 –> 01:41:08,940
is what has caused us to move.
2177
01:41:08,940 –> 01:41:11,820
Even though we’ve been using
it, depending on it for years,
2178
01:41:11,820 –> 01:41:16,820
we’re moving away from
the discrepancy model.
2179
01:41:17,100 –> 01:41:19,110
And then, the other piece is content.
2180
01:41:19,110 –> 01:41:21,501
Let’s take a look at the test,
2181
01:41:21,501 –> 01:41:24,450
and does it have all the
aspects of the skillset
2182
01:41:24,450 –> 01:41:25,980
that I wanna administer?
2183
01:41:25,980 –> 01:41:28,560
Does it have items that look at that?
2184
01:41:28,560 –> 01:41:31,050
If not, I need to find a different test,
2185
01:41:31,050 –> 01:41:33,037
or add something to this test.
2186
01:41:33,037 –> 01:41:35,587
“standard error of measurement”
is associated with,
2187
01:41:37,980 –> 01:41:39,051
it’s the error.
2188
01:41:39,051 –> 01:41:40,140
There’s error in everything.
2189
01:41:40,140 –> 01:41:41,629
If I were to give you folks a ruler,
2190
01:41:41,629 –> 01:41:43,470
that was a 12 inch ruler, and
ask you to measure a table
2191
01:41:43,470 –> 01:41:46,110
that was 59 inches long,
2192
01:41:46,110 –> 01:41:48,269
we are not all gonna
come up with 59 inches.
2193
01:41:48,269 –> 01:41:51,630
There’s going to be error
anytime we measure something.
2194
01:41:51,630 –> 01:41:56,630
And so, we use this Standard
Error Measurement to construct
2195
01:41:56,686 –> 01:41:58,860
what are known as “Confidence Intervals.”
2196
01:41:58,860 –> 01:42:01,020
And, you’re familiar, I think
you’re familiar with those,
2197
01:42:01,020 –> 01:42:05,862
or their bands where we believe
that the score truly falls.
2198
01:42:05,862 –> 01:42:08,340
So, we have an “Obtained Score.”
2199
01:42:08,340 –> 01:42:12,493
So, the obtained score is
the score you got, (coughs)
2200
01:42:13,611 –> 01:42:14,760
based on the number you
got right, on the test.
2201
01:42:14,760 –> 01:42:18,630
So, if it’s a, we’ll say
it’s a cognitive test,
2202
01:42:18,630 –> 01:42:20,090
based on the number you got right.
2203
01:42:20,090 –> 01:42:23,947
In this per example here, you
got an obtained score of 72.
2204
01:42:23,947 –> 01:42:25,890
Okay?
2205
01:42:25,890 –> 01:42:29,430
But, the computer program,
most test scorers,
2206
01:42:29,430 –> 01:42:31,950
most tests are computer scored these days,
2207
01:42:31,950 –> 01:42:34,890
by online computer programs. (coughs)
2208
01:42:34,890 –> 01:42:37,020
The computer program tells us that,
2209
01:42:37,020 –> 01:42:39,923
for this score, the standard
error measurement is three.
2210
01:42:39,923 –> 01:42:42,245
Now, that’s for this score.
2211
01:42:42,245 –> 01:42:44,610
Some tests, and this is an indicator
2212
01:42:44,610 –> 01:42:46,260
of the quality of the test,
2213
01:42:46,260 –> 01:42:50,220
If you are using a test, and
in the manual it tells you
2214
01:42:50,220 –> 01:42:52,938
the standard error of
measurement for every aspect
2215
01:42:52,938 –> 01:42:55,538
of that test is, we’ll say, three,
2216
01:42:55,538 –> 01:42:59,400
then that means they haven’t
gone to the trouble to,
2217
01:42:59,400 –> 01:43:01,890
they’re just giving you an average.
2218
01:43:01,890 –> 01:43:03,600
A well-developed test will give you
2219
01:43:03,600 –> 01:43:06,627
the standard error of
measure of every single score
2220
01:43:06,627 –> 01:43:09,277
(clears throat) so that you
can, because they change.
2221
01:43:10,167 –> 01:43:13,470
And so, in this case, the
standard average was three,
2222
01:43:13,470 –> 01:43:15,060
the youngster go to 72.
2223
01:43:15,060 –> 01:43:19,651
So, the federal regs say
that I have to report this,
2224
01:43:19,651 –> 01:43:22,410
when I report out the scores.
2225
01:43:22,410 –> 01:43:24,270
So, the way I do that is, and again,
2226
01:43:24,270 –> 01:43:26,720
at this, folks might need
this, didn’t know this,
2227
01:43:27,810 –> 01:43:29,891
but I just wanna run through it.
2228
01:43:29,891 –> 01:43:30,780
I got the Obtained Score, which is 72.
2229
01:43:30,780 –> 01:43:32,910
So, I add the confidence band,
2230
01:43:32,910 –> 01:43:36,120
and I subtract the
confidence band, I mean,
2231
01:43:36,120 –> 01:43:37,293
the standard error of measurement.
2232
01:43:37,293 –> 01:43:39,300
And, that gives me this confidence band.
2233
01:43:39,300 –> 01:43:44,300
So 72 minus 3, is a 69,
and 72 plus 3, is a 75.
2234
01:43:46,020 –> 01:43:50,730
I have to report to the parents
these scores here, okay?
2235
01:43:50,730 –> 01:43:54,033
And, here’s how we do that.
2236
01:43:55,950 –> 01:43:58,163
Go, oh, okay.
2237
01:44:02,293 –> 01:44:04,740
I got ahead of myself,
but let’s, we’ll go here.
2238
01:44:04,740 –> 01:44:08,790
So, this is important in the case,
2239
01:44:08,790 –> 01:44:10,503
and I see this quite a bit.
2240
01:44:11,504 –> 01:44:15,030
When we have youngsters
who are transitioning
2241
01:44:15,030 –> 01:44:19,380
from high school to adult services,
2242
01:44:19,380 –> 01:44:21,210
and who have been receiving services
2243
01:44:21,210 –> 01:44:23,970
throughout their school
career as an individual
2244
01:44:23,970 –> 01:44:26,700
who’s affected by an
intellectual disability.
2245
01:44:26,700 –> 01:44:30,180
So, our federal and state regs,
2246
01:44:30,180 –> 01:44:33,531
define an intellectual disability,
2247
01:44:33,531 –> 01:44:36,270
as performance on a cognitive score,
2248
01:44:36,270 –> 01:44:40,410
which falls 1.5 standard
deviations, from the mean.
2249
01:44:40,410 –> 01:44:43,110
And so, and also says,
2250
01:44:43,110 –> 01:44:46,489
we have existing concurrently deficits
2251
01:44:46,489 –> 01:44:47,493
and adaptive behavior.
2252
01:44:47,493 –> 01:44:48,960
So, you’d have to have adaptive behavior
2253
01:44:48,960 –> 01:44:53,010
that fell 1.5 standard
deviations below the mean.
2254
01:44:53,010 –> 01:44:55,400
So, whenever we’re assessing someone,
2255
01:44:55,400 –> 01:44:58,170
and we think they might have
an intellectual disability,
2256
01:44:58,170 –> 01:45:02,220
we have to do both cognitive
and adaptive behavior.
2257
01:45:02,220 –> 01:45:05,040
So, we said one and a half is,
2258
01:45:05,040 –> 01:45:07,740
we said the standard deviation is 15.
2259
01:45:07,740 –> 01:45:10,710
So, we said one and a
half standard deviations
2260
01:45:10,710 –> 01:45:13,200
would be 22 points.
2261
01:45:13,200 –> 01:45:18,200
So, that means that to be
eligible for special education
2262
01:45:19,380 –> 01:45:23,070
in Vermont as a, or in
most states, as a student
2263
01:45:23,070 –> 01:45:25,200
with an intellectual disability,
2264
01:45:25,200 –> 01:45:30,200
you would have to have a
cognitive score of 78 or lower.
2265
01:45:31,288 –> 01:45:35,400
Now, (clears throat) one of the things
2266
01:45:35,400 –> 01:45:37,800
that we are running into trouble with
2267
01:45:37,800 –> 01:45:42,800
is that (clears throat) we
had high school youngsters,
2268
01:45:42,960 –> 01:45:45,210
students who’ve been evaluated,
2269
01:45:45,210 –> 01:45:48,780
and the evaluator might have used a tool,
2270
01:45:48,780 –> 01:45:51,453
known as the Woodcock Johnson.
2271
01:45:52,320 –> 01:45:55,544
And now, it’s time to start talking about
2272
01:45:55,544 –> 01:45:58,080
transitioning to adult services.
2273
01:45:58,080 –> 01:46:00,840
And, we have, we might have
folk rehab at the table,
2274
01:46:00,840 –> 01:46:03,000
we might have mental health,
2275
01:46:03,000 –> 01:46:05,100
we might have whichever state agencies
2276
01:46:05,100 –> 01:46:06,603
might be the most appropriate.
2277
01:46:08,070 –> 01:46:12,563
And it’s, I’ve frequently
heard representatives
2278
01:46:13,550 –> 01:46:15,450
of these agencies say,
2279
01:46:15,450 –> 01:46:20,450
you need to do a Wechsler
Intelligence Scale assessment
2280
01:46:21,420 –> 01:46:25,680
in order, before you transition,
in order to be eligible.
2281
01:46:25,680 –> 01:46:27,900
And, when they tell, when you ask “why?”
2282
01:46:27,900 –> 01:46:32,460
they say, “well, it’s, our
regulations require it.”
2283
01:46:32,460 –> 01:46:36,600
So, here’s one of the, first
a piece of regulatory methods.
2284
01:46:36,600 –> 01:46:40,030
So, this is their, the
2285
01:46:40,921 –> 01:46:42,870
“Department of Disabilities,
Aging, and Independent Living,”
2286
01:46:42,870 –> 01:46:44,730
these are their requirements.
2287
01:46:44,730 –> 01:46:48,300
And, it says the most universally used
2288
01:46:48,300 –> 01:46:50,820
standardized intelligence
tests for school-aged children
2289
01:46:50,820 –> 01:46:54,240
up to 16 is the Wechsler
Intelligence Scale for Children,
2290
01:46:54,240 –> 01:46:55,143
which is true.
2291
01:46:56,200 –> 01:47:00,298
The most universally used
measure for age 16 and over,
2292
01:47:00,298 –> 01:47:03,504
is the Wechsler adult
scale, which is true.
2293
01:47:03,504 –> 01:47:07,743
So, for people with language,
blah blah, we have all this,
2294
01:47:08,850 –> 01:47:11,850
a combination of assessment
methods, just like we said,
2295
01:47:11,850 –> 01:47:15,090
for special ed, shall be
used by the psychologist,
2296
01:47:15,090 –> 01:47:17,820
shall use clinical judgment
to determine the best test
2297
01:47:17,820 –> 01:47:19,920
to use for the individual diagnosis
2298
01:47:19,920 –> 01:47:21,720
based on interpretation of test results.
2299
01:47:21,720 –> 01:47:24,890
Take into account standard
error of measurement
2300
01:47:24,890 –> 01:47:25,723
for the test used.
2301
01:47:25,723 –> 01:47:28,470
Very important, this is in their regs.
2302
01:47:28,470 –> 01:47:33,470
So, this does not say that you
have to use a Wechsler Scale
2303
01:47:34,770 –> 01:47:37,920
score, so if you have an active,
2304
01:47:37,920 –> 01:47:41,700
a recent Woodcock Johnson Cognitive score,
2305
01:47:41,700 –> 01:47:45,240
that suggests the presence of
an intellectual disability,
2306
01:47:45,240 –> 01:47:48,000
that can be accepted by adult services.
2307
01:47:48,000 –> 01:47:50,937
It does not, it only mentions in there,
2308
01:47:50,937 –> 01:47:54,210
is that the Wechsler Scale is
the most commonly used, okay?
2309
01:47:54,210 –> 01:47:56,260
Here’s the other piece I wanna point out.
2310
01:47:58,444 –> 01:48:00,780
The interpretation of test
results takes into account
2311
01:48:00,780 –> 01:48:04,500
the standard error of
measurements for the test used.
2312
01:48:04,500 –> 01:48:09,500
So, this is regulatory
myth, that’s may come up.
2313
01:48:09,573 –> 01:48:11,703
And, I don’t know if anyone on the,
2314
01:48:14,061 –> 01:48:15,293
our little training this morning,
2315
01:48:16,509 –> 01:48:17,970
has experienced this yet, but
it may come up in the future.
2316
01:48:17,970 –> 01:48:19,500
And so, we need to stay on top of this,
2317
01:48:19,500 –> 01:48:24,500
because it becomes an unnecessary
activity for the student.
2318
01:48:25,229 –> 01:48:27,133
And, sometimes the parents,
2319
01:48:27,133 –> 01:48:31,469
suppose it’s really close to
the youngsters graduation,
2320
01:48:31,469 –> 01:48:34,890
and there’s no time for the
school to do a Wechsler Scale,
2321
01:48:34,890 –> 01:48:37,890
even if they’d agreed to, or
thought it was they needed to,
2322
01:48:37,890 –> 01:48:40,340
it becomes incumbent on
a parent to find someone,
2323
01:48:41,409 –> 01:48:42,443
and hire someone, and pay to do that.
2324
01:48:43,394 –> 01:48:45,930
So, the Cognitive Scores that we have,
2325
01:48:45,930 –> 01:48:48,270
that, we have higher
reliability than the score,
2326
01:48:48,270 –> 01:48:51,360
for example, should suffice.
2327
01:48:51,360 –> 01:48:53,070
There’s nothing in their regulations
2328
01:48:53,070 –> 01:48:55,443
that would preclude that from happening.
2329
01:48:57,880 –> 01:48:59,047
So, all right.
2330
01:49:02,379 –> 01:49:04,986
We took a look at that, so.
2331
01:49:04,986 –> 01:49:07,563
Here’s how we’re gonna
say it in the report.
2332
01:49:09,367 –> 01:49:14,100
“Elwood obtained an Adaptive
Behavior Composite score of 72
2333
01:49:14,100 –> 01:49:17,530
during this administration
of the Vineland Adaptive
2334
01:49:17,530 –> 01:49:18,553
Behavior Scale.
2335
01:49:18,553 –> 01:49:20,610
Because there is error
associated with all measurement,
2336
01:49:20,610 –> 01:49:24,090
there is an 68% likelihood
that his actual skill
2337
01:49:24,090 –> 01:49:27,390
falls within the range of 69 to 75.”
2338
01:49:27,390 –> 01:49:30,180
We could change that to
Cognitive Performance.
2339
01:49:30,180 –> 01:49:31,920
We could have changed it to Mathematics,
2340
01:49:31,920 –> 01:49:32,753
whatever it might be.
2341
01:49:32,753 –> 01:49:37,753
But, so that’s the turn.
2342
01:49:38,410 –> 01:49:40,362
That’s what the state is looking for us,
2343
01:49:40,362 –> 01:49:41,603
when we report these results out,
2344
01:49:42,709 –> 01:49:45,630
to recognize that these
scores did not come down
2345
01:49:45,630 –> 01:49:49,380
from the mountain, inscribed
on tablets of stone.
2346
01:49:49,380 –> 01:49:50,910
There’s error here.
2347
01:49:50,910 –> 01:49:54,690
And, where the 68 came
from, is right here.
2348
01:49:54,690 –> 01:49:59,583
If you look on this little
normal curve, I have placed here.
2349
01:50:00,515 –> 01:50:05,515
So, in the normal curve,
look at those numbers there.
2350
01:50:06,030 –> 01:50:07,380
So, that little squiggle number
2351
01:50:07,380 –> 01:50:10,336
represents standard deviation
2352
01:50:10,336 –> 01:50:13,020
or standard error measurements units.
2353
01:50:13,020 –> 01:50:14,040
So, if you’ll notice,
2354
01:50:14,040 –> 01:50:16,830
if you go up one standard
error measurement,
2355
01:50:16,830 –> 01:50:20,520
that’s 34% of the population.
2356
01:50:20,520 –> 01:50:24,240
If you go down one standard
error measurement, that’s 34.
2357
01:50:24,240 –> 01:50:26,880
When you add those
together, you get to 68.
2358
01:50:26,880 –> 01:50:29,820
So, because we’ve gone
up one and down one, too,
2359
01:50:29,820 –> 01:50:32,070
the psychometric way to state this,
2360
01:50:32,070 –> 01:50:35,073
is that there’s a 68% likelihood.
2361
01:50:36,000 –> 01:50:38,017
Now, if you, no, I’m not gonna say that,
2362
01:50:38,017 –> 01:50:39,690
it’s just gonna muddy the water.
2363
01:50:39,690 –> 01:50:42,090
So, you can change that if you want to,
2364
01:50:42,090 –> 01:50:43,920
but the rule of thumb,
2365
01:50:43,920 –> 01:50:46,350
is that you only go up one
standard error of measurement,
2366
01:50:46,350 –> 01:50:48,500
and down one standard
error of measurement.
2367
01:50:49,350 –> 01:50:51,630
If you were to do it some other way,
2368
01:50:51,630 –> 01:50:53,940
just about every person in
the state would be eligible
2369
01:50:53,940 –> 01:50:55,050
for special ed.
2370
01:50:55,050 –> 01:50:58,211
So, hopefully that makes sense to folks.
2371
01:50:58,211 –> 01:50:59,142
I had another,
2372
01:50:59,142 –> 01:51:00,750
-[Mary Ellen] Hello?
-Yup?
2373
01:51:00,750 –> 01:51:02,426
There a question.
2374
01:51:02,426 –> 01:51:06,420
Jennifer asks, is there
a timeframe required
2375
01:51:06,420 –> 01:51:09,270
by adult services for how recent
2376
01:51:09,270 –> 01:51:11,914
the intelligence testing needs to be?
2377
01:51:11,914 –> 01:51:14,697
I have heard they want it within a year,
2378
01:51:14,697 –> 01:51:18,780
that it needs to be within,
which is reasonable.
2379
01:51:18,780 –> 01:51:21,420
Yeah, so I think that’s, I don’t wanna,
2380
01:51:21,420 –> 01:51:24,240
that’s what’s come out in
meetings that I’ve sat in,
2381
01:51:24,240 –> 01:51:26,010
where they said, “well,
is it within a year old?”
2382
01:51:26,010 –> 01:51:29,100
We say, “yeah.” And, they
said, “okay, we’ll take it.”
2383
01:51:29,100 –> 01:51:30,930
Where it talks about
2384
01:51:30,930 –> 01:51:35,100
the Department of Disabilities, Aging,
2385
01:51:35,100 –> 01:51:37,890
and Independent Living,
their regulations say
2386
01:51:37,890 –> 01:51:39,600
we have to take into account
2387
01:51:39,600 –> 01:51:42,420
the standard error of measurement
for the test to be used.
2388
01:51:42,420 –> 01:51:46,800
Okay, so, a slide I wanted
to show you is this,
2389
01:51:46,800 –> 01:51:48,660
it’s not there, but I’ll
bring it up next time
2390
01:51:48,660 –> 01:51:50,070
we get together.
2391
01:51:50,070 –> 01:51:51,970
But, here’s what can happen sometimes,
2392
01:51:53,490 –> 01:51:58,490
for adult services in Vermont,
in order to receive services
2393
01:51:58,890 –> 01:52:01,320
as a youngster with an
intellectual disability,
2394
01:52:01,320 –> 01:52:02,523
or a young adult,
2395
01:52:03,493 –> 01:52:05,653
or an adult with an
intellectual disability,
2396
01:52:05,653 –> 01:52:08,070
Look what it says up here.
2397
01:52:08,070 –> 01:52:11,310
You have to have a full scale score of 70,
2398
01:52:11,310 –> 01:52:12,660
up in the top there.
2399
01:52:12,660 –> 01:52:15,267
That’s two standard
deviations below the mean.
2400
01:52:15,267 –> 01:52:20,267
So, the situation arises, sometimes,
2401
01:52:20,910 –> 01:52:24,363
where you might have a student,
who you’ve been serving,
2402
01:52:25,470 –> 01:52:29,340
as a student with an intellectual
disability for many years,
2403
01:52:29,340 –> 01:52:31,560
and now when it comes to adult services,
2404
01:52:31,560 –> 01:52:34,683
that student might, say, have
a score of, we’ll say 72.
2405
01:52:35,970 –> 01:52:40,970
So, adult services might say,
“well, that student’s not,”
2406
01:52:40,974 –> 01:52:44,040
I’m not putting words, I don’t
wanna really speak for them,
2407
01:52:44,040 –> 01:52:46,117
but I’ve seen this happen.
2408
01:52:46,117 –> 01:52:49,260
“The student, this individual,
doesn’t meet our requirements
2409
01:52:49,260 –> 01:52:52,620
because they’re above the 70 cutoff.”
2410
01:52:52,620 –> 01:52:57,620
And so, their regulations also
say that you have to consider
2411
01:52:59,520 –> 01:53:01,950
the standard error of measurement.
2412
01:53:01,950 –> 01:53:03,570
So, this example here,
2413
01:53:03,570 –> 01:53:06,510
is considering the standard
error of measurement.
2414
01:53:06,510 –> 01:53:09,873
So, education regs say
you have to consider it.
2415
01:53:09,873 –> 01:53:13,770
And, so do the adult
services regs, say it.
2416
01:53:13,770 –> 01:53:16,781
Now, see that rate, that
confidence band there?
2417
01:53:16,781 –> 01:53:18,174
69 to 75.
2418
01:53:18,174 –> 01:53:21,480
The youngster, or this
individual, this young adult,
2419
01:53:21,480 –> 01:53:25,110
had an obtained score,
cognitive score of 72.
2420
01:53:25,110 –> 01:53:26,640
That allowed them to be,
2421
01:53:26,640 –> 01:53:30,480
received services in the general
ed public school setting,
2422
01:53:30,480 –> 01:53:33,429
because they were one and
a half standard deviation
2423
01:53:33,429 –> 01:53:34,590
below the mean.
2424
01:53:34,590 –> 01:53:36,780
But, that’s not two standards,
would need to be seven
2425
01:53:36,780 –> 01:53:39,690
to be two standard
deviations below the mean.
2426
01:53:39,690 –> 01:53:43,770
So, someone might construe
this as not being eligible.
2427
01:53:43,770 –> 01:53:45,060
However, when you look,
2428
01:53:45,060 –> 01:53:47,653
consider a standard error of measurement,
2429
01:53:47,653 –> 01:53:51,810
statistically, the probability
of this young adult’s score
2430
01:53:51,810 –> 01:53:56,810
being a, 72 is equal to the
probability of it being a 69,
2431
01:53:57,060 –> 01:54:00,630
a 70, a 71, a 73, a 74, or a 75.
2432
01:54:03,540 –> 01:54:04,500
Equal.
2433
01:54:04,500 –> 01:54:08,190
So, that means this
youngster is eligible for,
2434
01:54:08,190 –> 01:54:11,070
this young adult, is
eligible for adult services,
2435
01:54:11,070 –> 01:54:13,670
because when you consider the
standard error of measurement,
2436
01:54:13,670 –> 01:54:16,590
the youngster has a score of a 69,
2437
01:54:16,590 –> 01:54:19,230
which places them within
the eligibility range.
2438
01:54:19,230 –> 01:54:21,270
So, hopefully that makes sense to folks.
2439
01:54:21,270 –> 01:54:24,540
This is why these confidence
bands are so important.
2440
01:54:24,540 –> 01:54:28,854
Number one, we’re required to report them
2441
01:54:28,854 –> 01:54:31,290
when we report out results to parents,
2442
01:54:31,290 –> 01:54:33,300
and when we write our reports.
2443
01:54:33,300 –> 01:54:35,880
And number two, in these
situations where it gets, like,
2444
01:54:35,880 –> 01:54:39,540
a fine line, this is not
Olympic timing, like I said,
2445
01:54:39,540 –> 01:54:42,566
this, lots of error
associated with what we do,
2446
01:54:42,566 –> 01:54:46,200
it can result in whether or
not you get services or not,
2447
01:54:46,200 –> 01:54:48,933
as you transition from
school to adulthood.
2448
01:54:51,129 –> 01:54:53,580
All right, so, people okay with that?
2449
01:54:53,580 –> 01:54:54,960
We looked at this already.
2450
01:54:54,960 –> 01:54:57,900
So, this is just the writing
that you would, the narrative,
2451
01:54:57,900 –> 01:55:00,247
and you can substitute any other test.
2452
01:55:00,247 –> 01:55:04,230
“Elwood obtain the general
intellectual ability score,”
2453
01:55:04,230 –> 01:55:05,063
blah, blah, blah,
2454
01:55:05,063 –> 01:55:07,225
“on the Woodcock Johnson
test of cognitive ability,
2455
01:55:07,225 –> 01:55:08,760
because measure.”
2456
01:55:08,760 –> 01:55:10,023
And then there you go.
2457
01:55:12,154 –> 01:55:14,883
Okay, how we doing?
2458
01:55:16,710 –> 01:55:18,900
I think this is the most
exciting part, but anyway,
2459
01:55:18,900 –> 01:55:20,580
we’ll see, so.
2460
01:55:20,580 –> 01:55:23,997
Rich, can you stop? There’s
another question in the chat.
2461
01:55:23,997 –> 01:55:26,070
“Is the monitoring team asking
2462
01:55:26,070 –> 01:55:29,697
for the standard error of
measurement in our reports?”
2463
01:55:29,697 –> 01:55:31,980
If they’re not, they should be.
2464
01:55:31,980 –> 01:55:35,154
It’s part of, I don’t know
if, I don’t know if they do.
2465
01:55:35,154 –> 01:55:38,010
It’s part of the regulations.
2466
01:55:38,010 –> 01:55:41,490
It says that the teams,
and so, part of cons,
2467
01:55:41,490 –> 01:55:42,870
the writing is that,
2468
01:55:42,870 –> 01:55:45,810
educational planning
teams need to consider,
2469
01:55:45,810 –> 01:55:48,750
are required to consider, the
standard error of measurement.
2470
01:55:48,750 –> 01:55:52,230
It’s, “consider” has been
interpreted by the court.
2471
01:55:52,230 –> 01:55:53,930
Interpreted. And, I got this from,
2472
01:55:55,020 –> 01:55:58,560
I don’t know if people
remember Art Senocia,
2473
01:55:58,560 –> 01:56:03,390
he was a genius attorney,
special ed attorney,
2474
01:56:03,390 –> 01:56:05,280
a real child advocate.
2475
01:56:05,280 –> 01:56:09,726
Anyway, the courts have
interpreted the word “consider,”
2476
01:56:09,726 –> 01:56:12,870
to mean reporting it out, and also,
2477
01:56:12,870 –> 01:56:15,840
as part of eligibility decisions.
2478
01:56:15,840 –> 01:56:19,140
And so, we need to, we need to
let people know that’s there.
2479
01:56:19,140 –> 01:56:24,079
So, I don’t know how detailed
the monitoring teams look
2480
01:56:24,079 –> 01:56:26,553
at at these things.
2481
01:56:27,600 –> 01:56:32,600
This, my, you know, my
experience has been,
2482
01:56:32,970 –> 01:56:36,150
they spend a lot of time looking at dates.
2483
01:56:36,150 –> 01:56:38,610
Did you get this done by a certain time?
2484
01:56:38,610 –> 01:56:40,620
They’re looking to see
if we crossed our T’s,
2485
01:56:40,620 –> 01:56:42,060
and dotted our I’s,
2486
01:56:42,060 –> 01:56:45,038
and that might be one of the T’s and I’s
2487
01:56:45,038 –> 01:56:47,220
they’re looking for, so I
don’t know the answer to that,
2488
01:56:47,220 –> 01:56:50,790
but it can’t hurt, since
it’s required by regulation
2489
01:56:50,790 –> 01:56:53,793
to make that a practice that
we’re all engaging in now.
2490
01:56:55,530 –> 01:56:56,673
Okay. All right.
2491
01:56:58,452 –> 01:57:00,000
(clears throat) We’re gonna
close out the morning,
2492
01:57:00,000 –> 01:57:03,240
but just by talking about
the different kinds of scores
2493
01:57:03,240 –> 01:57:06,120
that we’re gonna, and when they might be
2494
01:57:06,120 –> 01:57:08,700
not such a good idea, and
when they might be okay.
2495
01:57:08,700 –> 01:57:11,040
So, standard scores.
2496
01:57:11,040 –> 01:57:13,940
By “standard,” that means that
they all have the same mean
2497
01:57:15,058 –> 01:57:16,020
and standard deviation.
2498
01:57:16,020 –> 01:57:20,310
So, all the tests that
you’ll be administering
2499
01:57:20,310 –> 01:57:25,290
as special educators, are
gonna have a mean of 100,
2500
01:57:25,290 –> 01:57:27,480
and a standard deviation of 15.
2501
01:57:27,480 –> 01:57:29,456
And, as I said earlier,
2502
01:57:29,456 –> 01:57:34,456
those tests that are
behavioral rating scales,
2503
01:57:34,471 –> 01:57:35,881
and tests that are,
2504
01:57:35,881 –> 01:57:38,550
measure emotional and
psychological functioning,
2505
01:57:38,550 –> 01:57:41,550
tend to have means of 50, and
a standard deviation of 10.
2506
01:57:41,550 –> 01:57:46,472
So, it’s incumbent upon us
to explain that to parents.
2507
01:57:46,472 –> 01:57:51,472
Percentile ranks. It’s
a relative standing.
2508
01:57:52,620 –> 01:57:56,190
It tells you where the youngster
is at this point in time,
2509
01:57:56,190 –> 01:58:01,048
and has no value in my
opinion, and, I’ll explain why,
2510
01:58:01,048 –> 01:58:03,060
other than that.
2511
01:58:03,060 –> 01:58:06,060
It tells you, “when this
test was administered,
2512
01:58:06,060 –> 01:58:10,380
this youngster’s performance
was as good as, or better than,
2513
01:58:10,380 –> 01:58:13,590
some percentage of the people
who were in the norm sample.”
2514
01:58:13,590 –> 01:58:15,288
And, I’ll show you where that comes from.
2515
01:58:15,288 –> 01:58:19,050
And, the reason I wanna show
you where it comes from,
2516
01:58:19,050 –> 01:58:21,176
is will help you understand
why it’s such a problem, okay?
2517
01:58:21,176 –> 01:58:25,590
Z scores, these are one
of my favorite scores,
2518
01:58:25,590 –> 01:58:28,345
but not people, but just to
let you know what they are,
2519
01:58:28,345 –> 01:58:31,320
they’re standard deviation units,
2520
01:58:31,320 –> 01:58:33,750
so a Z score of zero,
2521
01:58:33,750 –> 01:58:36,270
means that there’s no standard deviation.
2522
01:58:36,270 –> 01:58:39,230
So, if the standard
deviation of the test is 100,
2523
01:58:39,230 –> 01:58:41,550
it means my score is 100.
2524
01:58:41,550 –> 01:58:44,220
So, if a Z score is plus one,
2525
01:58:44,220 –> 01:58:48,570
it means I fell a standard
deviation above the mean.
2526
01:58:48,570 –> 01:58:50,120
And, all the tests that we use,
2527
01:58:51,706 –> 01:58:52,539
has a standard deviation of 15.
2528
01:58:52,539 –> 01:58:56,340
So, plus 1, means 15 added
to a hundred, I got a 115.
2529
01:58:56,340 –> 01:58:58,080
Here’s why I like Z scores,
2530
01:58:58,080 –> 01:59:01,170
some of the tests that I use
will print out a column for me
2531
01:59:01,170 –> 01:59:02,760
that lists Z scores.
2532
01:59:02,760 –> 01:59:05,220
And, some of these tests
you get three or four pages
2533
01:59:05,220 –> 01:59:06,554
of numbers to sift through.
2534
01:59:06,554 –> 01:59:10,080
I always go down the Z score column,
2535
01:59:10,080 –> 01:59:13,890
and anytime I see a plus,
I, kind of, circle it
2536
01:59:13,890 –> 01:59:16,620
with a green pen.
2537
01:59:16,620 –> 01:59:21,060
And, I see a minus, I
circle with a red pen.
2538
01:59:21,060 –> 01:59:24,030
And then, I look at the
number, if it’s a plus one,
2539
01:59:24,030 –> 01:59:26,670
I’ll put a plus next to
it, that’s a superpower,
2540
01:59:26,670 –> 01:59:29,010
’cause you’ve fallen a
standard deviation above.
2541
01:59:29,010 –> 01:59:32,130
If it’s a negative one, I
put a negative next to it,
2542
01:59:32,130 –> 01:59:34,020
and that’s something we need to address,
2543
01:59:34,020 –> 01:59:36,420
and as part of, in our
program and all that.
2544
01:59:36,420 –> 01:59:38,880
So, I like them because it’s a quick way,
2545
01:59:38,880 –> 01:59:40,560
so, you’ll probably never have to use ’em,
2546
01:59:40,560 –> 01:59:43,058
but I wanted to list them, (coughs)
2547
01:59:43,058 –> 01:59:45,940
it’s a quick way for me to scan
2548
01:59:47,307 –> 01:59:49,050
a pretty busy computer
print-out of scores,
2549
01:59:49,050 –> 01:59:51,963
and quickly identify, “what
are these youngster’s,
2550
01:59:52,941 –> 01:59:54,450
what’s this youngster’s
strengths and challenges.
2551
01:59:54,450 –> 01:59:55,590
Okay,
2552
01:59:55,590 –> 01:59:58,680
T scores, those are the
ones that psychologists use.
2553
01:59:58,680 –> 02:00:03,633
They have, it’s a mean of 50,
a standard deviation of 10.
2554
02:00:04,883 –> 02:00:09,633
Skills (laughs) scale.
Does that say scale scores?
2555
02:00:12,810 –> 02:00:14,510
[Ms. Phillip] Track My Progress!
2556
02:00:15,590 –> 02:00:16,591
What’s that?
2557
02:00:16,591 –> 02:00:18,422
Track my progress uses scaled scores.
2558
02:00:18,422 –> 02:00:19,255
There you go.
2559
02:00:19,255 –> 02:00:22,470
And so, they tend to be (coughs) developed
2560
02:00:22,470 –> 02:00:23,730
by the own test develop.
2561
02:00:23,730 –> 02:00:26,730
So, for example, most
scale scores and this,
2562
02:00:26,730 –> 02:00:29,700
you let me know if this
is different from yours,
2563
02:00:29,700 –> 02:00:31,173
Ms. Phillip.
2564
02:00:31,173 –> 02:00:36,173
So, if most scale scores are
on a scale from from 1 to 20,
2565
02:00:37,656 –> 02:00:42,240
with a mean of 10 and a
standard deviation of three.
2566
02:00:42,240 –> 02:00:44,730
Is that what you have on your progress?
2567
02:00:44,730 –> 02:00:46,620
So, it’s a different setup?
2568
02:00:46,620 –> 02:00:47,640
Yeah.
2569
02:00:47,640 –> 02:00:48,473
Okay.
2570
02:00:48,473 –> 02:00:51,210
So, where you gonna see this,
is on the Wechsler skills.
2571
02:00:51,210 –> 02:00:53,640
That’s a test that I’m sure
all of you’re familiar with.
2572
02:00:53,640 –> 02:00:54,900
A lot of psychologists use it.
2573
02:00:54,900 –> 02:00:58,740
So, it creates a problem, because (coughs)
2574
02:00:58,740 –> 02:01:03,150
you have this big overall
score, that’s a standard score.
2575
02:01:03,150 –> 02:01:08,010
So, you have a score, we’ll say
that it will say it’s an 89,
2576
02:01:08,010 –> 02:01:11,330
so you know, the mean is 100
and a standard deviation is 15,
2577
02:01:11,330 –> 02:01:13,787
so you know where, but then you have a,
2578
02:01:14,662 –> 02:01:18,543
let’s say a visual-processing
score of seven.
2579
02:01:19,542 –> 02:01:22,099
(grimaces) That’s, it’s
outta whack with other scores
2580
02:01:22,099 –> 02:01:22,932
that you’re having.
2581
02:01:22,932 –> 02:01:25,781
So, you have to explain to
folks that on this test,
2582
02:01:25,781 –> 02:01:30,720
a 10 is an average score, and
a 7 is three points below.
2583
02:01:30,720 –> 02:01:33,870
That’s an area of concern
that we might be looking at.
2584
02:01:33,870 –> 02:01:36,150
And, so that’s what scale scores are
2585
02:01:36,150 –> 02:01:38,223
and with the exception of what we,
2586
02:01:39,077 –> 02:01:40,918
and I’m sure there are
other exceptions as well,
2587
02:01:40,918 –> 02:01:42,693
but most of the tests
you’re gonna be exposed to,
2588
02:01:42,693 –> 02:01:45,030
it’s educational.
2589
02:01:45,030 –> 02:01:49,950
It’s gonna be a 1 to 20
scale, mean of 10, standard.
2590
02:01:49,950 –> 02:01:51,960
And so, when you get your report,
2591
02:01:51,960 –> 02:01:54,780
and it lists out scale scores,
you’ll be able to go through.
2592
02:01:54,780 –> 02:01:56,940
And then, we have developmental scores,
2593
02:01:56,940 –> 02:01:58,290
and age equivalent scores.
2594
02:01:58,290 –> 02:02:00,990
And, I was told by my lovely bride,
2595
02:02:00,990 –> 02:02:03,150
that I’m not allowed to use
the language I like to use
2596
02:02:03,150 –> 02:02:05,670
to explain these scores, except that,
2597
02:02:05,670 –> 02:02:09,180
do not use these scores.
These are useless.
2598
02:02:09,180 –> 02:02:13,080
These are useless scores, age
and grade equivalent scores.
2599
02:02:13,080 –> 02:02:15,150
And, I’ll tell you why.
2600
02:02:15,150 –> 02:02:17,385
Oh, first let me tell you a story.
2601
02:02:17,385 –> 02:02:19,863
It’s a good way to end
this up, with a fun story.
2602
02:02:21,567 –> 02:02:25,830
So, I was, had a contract
with the district
2603
02:02:25,830 –> 02:02:29,970
to come every other week
and perform assessments
2604
02:02:29,970 –> 02:02:32,617
and they would have, they’d
have a victim waiting for me
2605
02:02:32,617 –> 02:02:33,450
when I got there.
2606
02:02:33,450 –> 02:02:36,443
And so, I arrived at
this elementary school,
2607
02:02:36,443 –> 02:02:38,100
8:00 in the morning,
2608
02:02:38,100 –> 02:02:39,960
checked in with the
administrative assistant,
2609
02:02:39,960 –> 02:02:43,290
and she said to me, “the
superintendent’s office called,
2610
02:02:43,290 –> 02:02:45,739
they need you to go to
that office immediately.”
2611
02:02:45,739 –> 02:02:50,040
So, for a psychologist,
your stomach does a flip.
2612
02:02:50,040 –> 02:02:51,899
What am I walking into
here? Has there been?
2613
02:02:51,899 –> 02:02:53,880
This has had happened to me before,
2614
02:02:53,880 –> 02:02:56,013
and it was like a student death,
2615
02:02:56,876 –> 02:02:59,053
or, so it’s just a
terrible, horrible thing.
2616
02:02:59,053 –> 02:03:02,891
So, I get there, the
superintendent’s there
2617
02:03:02,891 –> 02:03:04,980
with the special ed director
and a special educator,
2618
02:03:04,980 –> 02:03:07,680
and they tell me, “we have
a due process hearing today
2619
02:03:07,680 –> 02:03:09,978
at 12 o’clock, and we’d like
you to be our expert witness.”
2620
02:03:09,978 –> 02:03:14,978
And I said, “are you kidding?
How can I be prepared?”
2621
02:03:15,083 –> 02:03:18,090
So anyway, they explained
the situation to me.
2622
02:03:18,090 –> 02:03:21,270
What it was, was a youngster whose parents
2623
02:03:21,270 –> 02:03:23,675
unilaterally placed him
in a private school.
2624
02:03:23,675 –> 02:03:26,850
And now, they were suing
the school district
2625
02:03:26,850 –> 02:03:28,900
to pay the tuition in the private school,
2626
02:03:29,837 –> 02:03:32,438
because the kid had only
been there three months,
2627
02:03:32,438 –> 02:03:36,784
but his reading had increased by a year,
2628
02:03:36,784 –> 02:03:40,363
just by being, in three months,
by being in this new school.
2629
02:03:40,363 –> 02:03:43,920
So, they were saying, “that’s
evidence that your school
2630
02:03:43,920 –> 02:03:45,330
doesn’t know what they’re doing,
2631
02:03:45,330 –> 02:03:47,230
this school does. We need you to pay.”
2632
02:03:48,180 –> 02:03:53,180
So, I asked to see the evaluation
that the school had done
2633
02:03:54,120 –> 02:03:56,320
when I, they had administered this test
2634
02:03:57,631 –> 02:03:58,493
called the, the Gray Oral Reading.
2635
02:04:00,223 –> 02:04:02,722
And, so I asked the special educator,
2636
02:04:02,722 –> 02:04:04,380
had she administered that.
2637
02:04:04,380 –> 02:04:07,170
She said she had, she
showed me her results.
2638
02:04:07,170 –> 02:04:10,837
Then I asked, “do you have
the manual for this test?”
2639
02:04:10,837 –> 02:04:11,677
“We do.”
2640
02:04:11,677 –> 02:04:13,500
“Get me the manual.”
2641
02:04:13,500 –> 02:04:16,266
So, here it was. 10 minutes
earlier, I would say, “no way.”
2642
02:04:16,266 –> 02:04:19,167
I opened the manual, and
I said, “I’ll do it.”
2643
02:04:20,010 –> 02:04:21,450
And, here’s why.
2644
02:04:21,450 –> 02:04:26,450
So, suppose I administer
this KeyMath test,
2645
02:04:28,075 –> 02:04:31,230
and these are, they’re upwardly
spiraling in difficulties.
2646
02:04:31,230 –> 02:04:32,430
So, those are the items,
2647
02:04:33,997 –> 02:04:35,010
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, up to 18.
2648
02:04:35,010 –> 02:04:37,113
And, I administered to Joey and Billy.
2649
02:04:38,010 –> 02:04:40,650
And so, here’s how Joey does.
2650
02:04:40,650 –> 02:04:43,860
He gets the first seven
right, gets one wrong,
2651
02:04:43,860 –> 02:04:46,440
gets the ninth oneth right,
and gets the rest of ’em wrong,
2652
02:04:46,440 –> 02:04:49,260
which is typical behavior we would expect,
2653
02:04:49,260 –> 02:04:52,635
given the upwards in spiraling difficulty.
2654
02:04:52,635 –> 02:04:54,768
I administered to Billy.
2655
02:04:54,768 –> 02:04:57,840
He gets the first two right,
gets the next one wrong,
2656
02:04:57,840 –> 02:05:00,516
next one right, next one wrong,
next one right, two wrong.
2657
02:05:00,516 –> 02:05:02,040
He’s got these flitter skills.
2658
02:05:02,040 –> 02:05:04,020
Gets that one right, gets two wrong.
2659
02:05:04,020 –> 02:05:05,130
Look at this!
2660
02:05:05,130 –> 02:05:07,290
He got number 12 right, which is hard.
2661
02:05:07,290 –> 02:05:09,001
14 right, 15.
2662
02:05:09,001 –> 02:05:13,620
So, age and grade equivalent scores,
2663
02:05:13,620 –> 02:05:15,180
the way they’re developed is,
2664
02:05:15,180 –> 02:05:18,278
they take the raw score you
got, how many you got right.
2665
02:05:18,278 –> 02:05:19,563
And, they say,
2666
02:05:21,223 –> 02:05:23,693
“okay, what’s the average
grade equivalent of someone,
2667
02:05:24,615 –> 02:05:26,311
what’s the average grade someone in,
2668
02:05:26,311 –> 02:05:27,925
who got that same score?”
2669
02:05:27,925 –> 02:05:29,760
So, in this case, the raw score is eight.
2670
02:05:29,760 –> 02:05:32,910
And, on this test, if you got eight right,
2671
02:05:32,910 –> 02:05:35,090
you got a grade equivalent score of 6.6.
2672
02:05:36,450 –> 02:05:37,533
That’s what Joey got.
2673
02:05:38,970 –> 02:05:42,139
Billy got the same score, 6.6.
2674
02:05:42,139 –> 02:05:45,243
Do these two kids have
the same math skills?
2675
02:05:45,243 –> 02:05:48,360
No way, no way.
2676
02:05:48,360 –> 02:05:53,010
Now, I’m there the next
week, and Elwood shows up,
2677
02:05:53,010 –> 02:05:56,823
I administer him the test,
and he gets one more right.
2678
02:05:58,020 –> 02:06:00,420
And, what’s his grade equivalent?
2679
02:06:00,420 –> 02:06:03,153
These are real, by the
way, these are real scores,
2680
02:06:04,939 –> 02:06:07,930
from the, and so, his
grade equivalent is 7.6.
2681
02:06:07,930 –> 02:06:10,350
And, it went up by one.
2682
02:06:10,350 –> 02:06:14,010
By getting one more right,
he went up by one grade.
2683
02:06:14,010 –> 02:06:15,735
Well, guess what?
2684
02:06:15,735 –> 02:06:16,950
That little story I was telling you?
2685
02:06:16,950 –> 02:06:19,020
The same thing happened,
2686
02:06:19,020 –> 02:06:21,900
when this private school
administered the Gray Oral,
2687
02:06:21,900 –> 02:06:23,655
that kid got one more item right,
2688
02:06:23,655 –> 02:06:26,010
and in the, when you looked in the norms,
2689
02:06:26,010 –> 02:06:28,020
it jumped him up a full grade.
2690
02:06:28,020 –> 02:06:30,960
And, who wants to guess how that due here?
2691
02:06:30,960 –> 02:06:33,243
Due process hearing turned out?
2692
02:06:34,740 –> 02:06:36,363
The school did not have to pay.
2693
02:06:37,350 –> 02:06:39,450
They were manipulating the numbers
2694
02:06:39,450 –> 02:06:42,780
to represent a year’s
growth, which did not occur.
2695
02:06:42,780 –> 02:06:47,780
So, aside from that experience,
these scores are no value.
2696
02:06:47,873 –> 02:06:51,420
And really we should stay away from them.
2697
02:06:51,420 –> 02:06:52,713
And, as I said earlier,
2698
02:06:54,067 –> 02:06:56,387
if you get a report from an
evaluator, and you have a,
2699
02:06:56,387 –> 02:06:58,950
and so these age equivalent
scores, and grade,
2700
02:06:58,950 –> 02:07:01,320
you have a young students,
8 or 10 years old,
2701
02:07:01,320 –> 02:07:03,275
and you’re being told they’re functioning
2702
02:07:03,275 –> 02:07:08,220
on the third, three year
old, six month level.
2703
02:07:08,220 –> 02:07:09,960
Well, this youngster’s been on the planet.
2704
02:07:09,960 –> 02:07:11,946
Oh, that can’t be right.
2705
02:07:11,946 –> 02:07:13,593
There’s other things going on there.
2706
02:07:13,593 –> 02:07:15,600
This youngster’s been on the planet.
2707
02:07:15,600 –> 02:07:18,960
They do not compare well,
or do not compare accurately
2708
02:07:18,960 –> 02:07:21,453
with someone so low, number one.
2709
02:07:22,474 –> 02:07:26,963
Number two, the scores had
just, so, just as an aside,
2710
02:07:26,963 –> 02:07:29,977
I told you I’m associated
with a test publisher,
2711
02:07:29,977 –> 02:07:33,063
and I asked a statistician,
2712
02:07:34,043 –> 02:07:37,076
“why the heck do you continue to include
2713
02:07:37,076 –> 02:07:41,580
age and grade equivalent
scores, when it’s contrary
2714
02:07:41,580 –> 02:07:44,070
to everything else you’re
doing with this test?”
2715
02:07:44,070 –> 02:07:46,200
And, they wouldn’t answer me.
2716
02:07:46,200 –> 02:07:49,410
And, my assumption is that
it’s a marketing thing.
2717
02:07:49,410 –> 02:07:50,970
People like these scores,
2718
02:07:50,970 –> 02:07:52,380
because they think they
know what they mean,
2719
02:07:52,380 –> 02:07:54,843
but they don’t really mean anything.
2720
02:07:54,843 –> 02:07:57,036
So, let’s stay away from those guys.
2721
02:07:57,036 –> 02:07:59,335
Hopefully, I haven’t made
anyone mad at me with this,
2722
02:07:59,335 –> 02:08:00,510
but they really are not helpful.
2723
02:08:00,510 –> 02:08:01,343
Okay.
2724
02:08:02,441 –> 02:08:04,830
Is it too late in the day to calculate?
2725
02:08:04,830 –> 02:08:06,690
So, I want to talk about percentile ranks,
2726
02:08:06,690 –> 02:08:10,503
before we leave into it, and
why these can create problems.
2727
02:08:11,462 –> 02:08:15,030
So, don’t get afraid by that box there.
2728
02:08:15,030 –> 02:08:19,110
It’s just, so, this comes from a manual,
2729
02:08:19,110 –> 02:08:21,734
and I just wanna show you what happens.
2730
02:08:21,734 –> 02:08:23,658
So, what, on the first column where it’s,
2731
02:08:23,658 –> 02:08:25,130
it’s just the scores that you can get.
2732
02:08:25,130 –> 02:08:30,130
(coughs) So, I got a raw score
of 44 right, on this test.
2733
02:08:30,720 –> 02:08:33,930
So, there I am marked
on the left-hand column.
2734
02:08:33,930 –> 02:08:38,550
(clears throat) And so, then
I wanna know how many people
2735
02:08:38,550 –> 02:08:40,620
this is how percentile
ranks gets calculated,
2736
02:08:40,620 –> 02:08:43,565
I wanna know how many
people fell below me.
2737
02:08:43,565 –> 02:08:46,667
So, I go over there, see how,
2738
02:08:46,667 –> 02:08:47,570
that I’m pointing to that 54.7?
2739
02:08:48,810 –> 02:08:51,450
That’s aligns with the 43,
that’s the score below me.
2740
02:08:51,450 –> 02:08:55,590
So, and this is, on the right,
accumulative percentage.
2741
02:08:55,590 –> 02:08:58,710
It counts the people who fell below me.
2742
02:08:58,710 –> 02:09:03,710
So, 54.7% of the people
below me, did less well.
2743
02:09:07,740 –> 02:09:09,510
So, I did better than them.
2744
02:09:09,510 –> 02:09:11,976
But, if I look across here, (coughs)
2745
02:09:11,976 –> 02:09:15,464
see those numbers that say 4.3%?
2746
02:09:15,464 –> 02:09:19,200
It says that, “hey, you’re
not the only one, Rich,
2747
02:09:19,200 –> 02:09:21,006
who got a score of 44.
2748
02:09:21,006 –> 02:09:24,847
4.3% of the people in the
norm sample, also go a 44.
2749
02:09:24,847 –> 02:09:27,502
So, you don’t own this score. (coughs)
2750
02:09:27,502 –> 02:09:31,278
You’re sharing it with 4.2%
or 4.3 of the population.
2751
02:09:31,278 –> 02:09:35,910
So, what they do is, they
give me half of that, instead.
2752
02:09:35,910 –> 02:09:38,858
What happens is, it’s the 54.7,
2753
02:09:38,858 –> 02:09:42,930
that’s the people below me, okay?
2754
02:09:42,930 –> 02:09:46,890
And now, the half of that 4.3, is 2.51.
2755
02:09:46,890 –> 02:09:51,360
They add that to mine, and
now I’m at the 57 percentile.
2756
02:09:51,360 –> 02:09:55,680
So, the way I say that,
represents how it’s calculated.
2757
02:09:55,680 –> 02:10:00,680
Elwood did as better, as
well as, or better than,
2758
02:10:00,930 –> 02:10:04,110
So, the, “as well as”
accounts for the 4.3,
2759
02:10:04,110 –> 02:10:07,743
the population I shared this
score with, or better than,
2760
02:10:09,009 –> 02:10:12,510
that accounts for the 54.7%
that I did better than, okay?
2761
02:10:12,510 –> 02:10:17,510
So, I did as well as, or better
than, 57% of the population.
2762
02:10:17,970 –> 02:10:20,310
So, I’m at the 57th percentile.
2763
02:10:20,310 –> 02:10:24,067
Okay, and so this is
how we would write that.
2764
02:10:24,067 –> 02:10:26,317
“Elwood performed as
well as, or better than,
2765
02:10:27,659 –> 02:10:29,297
50% of the individuals
who took this test.”
2766
02:10:31,476 –> 02:10:33,090
Now, (coughs) here’s
where the problem arises.
2767
02:10:33,090 –> 02:10:37,740
We should never use these
scores to track progress.
2768
02:10:37,740 –> 02:10:39,690
The only thing they’re good for,
2769
02:10:39,690 –> 02:10:42,780
is to tell us where this youngster is
2770
02:10:42,780 –> 02:10:44,850
at any given point in time.
2771
02:10:44,850 –> 02:10:48,270
And, I’ll try to show you why.
2772
02:10:48,270 –> 02:10:51,663
So, this is the normal curve again.
2773
02:10:52,530 –> 02:10:56,580
And, so imagine, see how it
has the hump in the middle
2774
02:10:56,580 –> 02:10:57,870
and it’s right at the mean?
2775
02:10:57,870 –> 02:10:59,270
Well, the “mean” means that,
2776
02:11:00,447 –> 02:11:02,130
that’s where most of the people are.
2777
02:11:02,130 –> 02:11:03,930
So, imagine that these are young people
2778
02:11:03,930 –> 02:11:06,630
standing on each other’s shoulders,
2779
02:11:06,630 –> 02:11:09,660
and the taller it is, the
more people there are in it.
2780
02:11:09,660 –> 02:11:13,500
And, so, (coughs) suppose
I fall at the mean,
2781
02:11:13,500 –> 02:11:16,383
and I’m at the 50th percentile, okay?
2782
02:11:16,383 –> 02:11:19,290
And now, you administer,
2783
02:11:19,290 –> 02:11:21,330
the next year you would
administer this test.
2784
02:11:21,330 –> 02:11:23,787
Now, I’m at the mean, I’m
at the 50th percentile.
2785
02:11:23,787 –> 02:11:28,787
You administer this test,
and instead of getting a 100,
2786
02:11:30,030 –> 02:11:35,030
I get a 102, and I move
a little bit to the right
2787
02:11:35,820 –> 02:11:36,933
of that line.
2788
02:11:37,890 –> 02:11:42,540
Well, that’s, I have jumped
over a whole bunch of people.
2789
02:11:42,540 –> 02:11:45,300
So, my percentile rank is
going to go through the roof.
2790
02:11:45,300 –> 02:11:46,675
Remember?
2791
02:11:46,675 –> 02:11:47,910
‘Cause we’re counting all
the people who are below me.
2792
02:11:47,910 –> 02:11:51,060
So, even though I only
made a little gain, (cough)
2793
02:11:51,060 –> 02:11:52,950
rather than being at the 50 percentile,
2794
02:11:52,950 –> 02:11:56,130
I might be at the 65th percentile,
or something like that.
2795
02:11:56,130 –> 02:11:58,487
Just, do you understand what’s happening?
2796
02:11:58,487 –> 02:12:00,930
And so, since we’re all gathered here,
2797
02:12:00,930 –> 02:12:05,930
a small gain in a percentile
score at the mean,
2798
02:12:06,930 –> 02:12:10,728
results in a huge gain
in your percentile rank.
2799
02:12:10,728 –> 02:12:15,728
Now, conversely, the young
people that we are concerned with
2800
02:12:16,230 –> 02:12:20,246
oftentimes fall far to the left, here.
2801
02:12:20,246 –> 02:12:22,563
And, there aren’t many people down there.
2802
02:12:24,182 –> 02:12:27,780
So, I can make huge gains, and I,
2803
02:12:27,780 –> 02:12:29,880
but I don’t jump over that many people
2804
02:12:29,880 –> 02:12:32,400
because if they’re all
standing on shoulders,
2805
02:12:32,400 –> 02:12:33,660
there aren’t a lot of people there.
2806
02:12:33,660 –> 02:12:36,630
So, my percentile rank
really doesn’t go up
2807
02:12:36,630 –> 02:12:40,170
because there’s no one
down there to, to pass.
2808
02:12:40,170 –> 02:12:42,390
So, it doesn’t accurately
represent the growth.
2809
02:12:42,390 –> 02:12:45,240
So, I could have made
the same amount of growth
2810
02:12:45,240 –> 02:12:47,970
as someone who was at the 50th percentile
2811
02:12:47,970 –> 02:12:51,864
who had a huge gain in
their percentile rank score.
2812
02:12:51,864 –> 02:12:55,144
But, because I’m down at this end,
2813
02:12:55,144 –> 02:12:56,670
I’ve made the same amount of growth,
2814
02:12:56,670 –> 02:12:58,530
I don’t get a change
in my percentile rank,
2815
02:12:58,530 –> 02:13:00,448
’cause there’s no one to jump over.
2816
02:13:00,448 –> 02:13:01,890
They’re not enough of us down there.
2817
02:13:01,890 –> 02:13:03,483
Does that make sense to folks?
2818
02:13:06,810 –> 02:13:10,200
So, in terms of scores,
2819
02:13:10,200 –> 02:13:12,450
percentile ranks are
good for letting us know,
2820
02:13:12,450 –> 02:13:15,570
right now, today, this is where
the youngster’s performing
2821
02:13:15,570 –> 02:13:17,190
and that’s where it needs to end.
2822
02:13:17,190 –> 02:13:20,070
We don’t want to use these
for measuring growth,
2823
02:13:20,070 –> 02:13:22,435
or progress, or anything like that,
2824
02:13:22,435 –> 02:13:23,268
because they’re not great measures.
2825
02:13:23,268 –> 02:13:27,853
Especially, for folks who
are following, you know,
2826
02:13:27,853 –> 02:13:31,020
1.5/2 standard deviations, below the mean.
2827
02:13:31,020 –> 02:13:33,210
You’re never gonna see
any documented growth
2828
02:13:33,210 –> 02:13:34,950
based on percentile ranks.
2829
02:13:34,950 –> 02:13:36,420
Or, if you do, it’s gonna be minimal.
2830
02:13:36,420 –> 02:13:38,070
It’s gonna be in the decimals.
2831
02:13:38,070 –> 02:13:40,567
Okay. All right.
2832
02:13:40,567 –> 02:13:43,680
During our next session, what
I wanna do is take a look
2833
02:13:43,680 –> 02:13:48,300
at some commonly used tests,
and what they measure,
2834
02:13:48,300 –> 02:13:49,410
and how they measure.
2835
02:13:49,410 –> 02:13:51,900
And, kind of, get a start on
the cross-battery approach
2836
02:13:51,900 –> 02:13:56,900
to picking tests to match
the responsibilities,
2837
02:13:57,864 –> 02:14:00,779
response abilities, of the youngsters
2838
02:14:00,779 –> 02:14:02,223
that we’re interested in.
